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doc
11-05-2004, 05:01 PM
Any thoughts on Arafat's impending death? Surprised no one found this sudden demise "interesting"...

doc
11-05-2004, 05:08 PM
October 23:

Earlier this week, on Monday, October 18, a medical team from Egypt and Palestinian doctors from Jerusalem and Nablus gave the 75-year old Palestinian leader a thorough check-up after he complained of severe pains. They decided provisionally that he was suffering from stones on the gall bladder that needed to be surgically removed and an acute intestinal infection, which is the more serious ailment because of its recurrence within a short period despite medication. For a definitive diagnosis, they want him X-rayed under hospital conditions which are lacking in Ramallah.

Even in extreme pain, Arafat keeps his eye on the main chance. He and his close aides have grasped that ill health offers him an opportunity to break out of the siege Israel clamped down on his Ramallah quarters after the failed Karin-A weapons smuggling episode in January 200.

The deterioration in Arafat’s health has caught Sharon unawares....

November 5:

PARIS - Yasser Arafat is in a coma and is "between life and death," though he is not brain dead, his spokeswoman said Friday. Doctors still had no diagnosis, but anxious Palestinian officials were already looking for ways to prevent unrest if their 75-year-old leader dies.

Leila Shahid, the Palestinian envoy to France, strongly denied French and Israeli media reports that Arafat was being kept alive on life support amid conflicting reports over his condition after a sharp decline a day earlier.

"I can assure you that there is no brain death," Shahid told French RTL radio. "He is in a coma. We don't know the type, but it's a reversible coma. ... Today we can say that, given his condition and age, he is at a critical point between life and death."

Shahid suggested the coma occurred after he was put under anesthesia to have additional medical tests, including an endoscopy, colonoscopy and a biopsy of the spinal cord....

mortal
11-05-2004, 05:59 PM
I hope he is in a great deal of pain.

See you in hell :waving

dogchow108
11-05-2004, 07:16 PM
Part of me wants Arafat to die a horrible, violent and trecherous death- preferably at the hands of someone like his bitch wife.

But then part of me wants him to die a peaceful, painless, natural and dignified death. His followers should see what kind of death their Jihadist leader affords himself while encouraging his people to die the way they have been for years on end, both inside and outside of now and permanently Jewish Israel.

This man has gotten "his" people absolutely nothing from start to finish. Its about time that the losers of the 1948 war finally won something. This will be a good start, whether they like to admit it or not. Perhaps now they can find a way out of the "refugee" status that has been forced upon them by their leadership for over 50 years.

Doc- really, i was waiting for the bastard to die before saying anything but its just as well this thread is up here.

daodejing
11-05-2004, 08:20 PM
Doc, I'm seldom surprised or intrigued by the impending transition of an angry old man.

doc
11-06-2004, 05:35 AM
I find it all very intriguing, from a medical standpoint. Mossad strikes again?

Politically, it should be very helpful towards peace in the Middle East. There should be many changes in the near future.

zachsan
11-08-2004, 05:57 PM
i think it's great. he deserves to die, but killing him would make him a martyr. so instead he just goes peacefully on his way. it's just a shame that his organization will now have plenty of time and warning to make arrangements for a successor.

dogchow108
11-08-2004, 11:24 PM
well, this time he wont be running for presidency if they have elections.

zachsan
11-08-2004, 11:32 PM
forgive me if i'm a bit behind the times, but is anyone even pretending that a future palestinian state would be a democratic one?

dogchow108
11-09-2004, 12:38 AM
Many Palestinians, at least that you hear of in the media/propaganda machina do....but then since when does a Palestinian's voice count under the PA?

lester1/2jr
11-10-2004, 08:32 PM
give him all the medical care he needs. hahaha. The best was when they caught saddam "I want to negotiate" hahaha fake ass thug

doc
11-12-2004, 07:48 AM
Actually, I was referring more to Arafat's medical condition, when I started this thread. I found the progression of his illness quite bizarre. But, I'm jet lagged to hell, so more later once the head starts thinking clearly again.

shaolinstylee
11-13-2004, 12:19 AM
The only thing I got was conflicting reports... coma, brain dead, dead, etc.. then they just said he was dead. The footage they showed of his funeral and burrial and stuff was nuts..

dogchow108
11-13-2004, 07:04 PM
This article pretty mush describes my feling towards the masturbatory hypocracy thats been going on recently with Arafat's Burial.

http://clarityandresolve.com/archives/2004/11/he_conned_the_w_1.html

The leaders of the world who even pretended to be ailed by this man's passing should seriously be examined in terms of their qualifications as leaders in a world that wishes to work towards peace.

BTW, the turnout for Arafat's for Arafat's memorial procession: 800-1500 people at best. If his own people dont care to mourn him, you have to wonder why WE DO.

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/501078.html

LeiYunFat
11-13-2004, 07:50 PM
Yes sir, DC. The quotes on clairity and resolve are pretty...well, pretty persuasive in terms of the UN sucking, which it does.

doc
11-13-2004, 08:33 PM
Well, I'm more interested in the medical aspects of his illness. I found it all a bit bizarre.

First, in Ramallah, his doctors state that he's got gallstone disease. A diagnosis made with radiological evidence apparently, as they also state that they don't have access to proper x ray facilities. OK, fine. Right upper quadrant pain after a meal can signify gallstone disease. And, Arafat took ill after a meal.

Wonder where his taste tester was....

Then, we see a picture of Arafat walking to a helicopter. There are also photos of him sitting and smiling before his departure to France. Not exactly the picture of ill health. People that have serious gallstone disease, with obstruction and infection, are generally not happy walking about campers. But, there are variations.

Upon arrival to France, he undergoes colonoscopy, gastroscopy, and no doubt blood work tests. They would have been horribly remiss if they didn't also investigate the gallstone issue, especially since mention was made of it in Palestine. So, it's safe to assume they ruled out gallstone disease and ascending cholangitis. His endoscopies were clean, as were the rest of his tests, tests which also no doubt included a chest x ray.

Next, we hear he is in a coma. (The Palestinians claim he is fine. Idiocy at it's best.)

The differential diagnosis for coma is quite extensive. But, in a man his age, one thinks of sepsis, from either pneumonia, urinary tract infection, ascending cholangitis (gall bladder) or some other intra abdominal source. Sepsis accompanied by changes in blood counts, fever, and other signs, depending upon the source. Chest x rays can diagnose pneumonia, urinalysis can identify infection, (along with blood counts), and physical exam and endoscopy with other x ray tests can identify intra abdominal sources of infection. Apparently, this was not the issue.

A spinal "biopsy", which I infer to be a spinal tap to obtain cerebrospinal fluid, was performed. Again, they were looking for blood or signs of infection. Nothing was found.

In a situation where someone presents with right upper quadrant pain after a meal, which rapidly progresses to coma, cause unidentifiable, the only thing I can think of is a toxin. They ruled out everything else.

Mossad strikes again?

dogchow108
11-17-2004, 12:07 AM
Well, doc, that leaves me with a tough choice:

Be happy Arafat just died, or be proud that the Mossad finally waxed him.

lester1/2jr
11-17-2004, 12:11 AM
speaking of yassir arafat check out this beer I just bought
http://www.ratebeer.com/Ratings/Beer/Beer-Ratings.asp?BeerID=18543&Show=0&SortedBy=3

23% alcohol by volume. ten dollars a bottle!

zachsan
11-17-2004, 03:39 PM
or, maybe all of this is a hoax. maybe arafat suddenly had a change of heart and wanted out, but knew he would irreparably damage the morale of the palestinian cause (or get whacked) if he did so. so he feigned his own death.

but all joking aside, it was probably aliens.

LeiYunFat
11-17-2004, 11:04 PM
Originally posted by zachsan

but all joking aside, it was probably aliens.

Is there a doubt in your mind?

lester1/2jr
11-17-2004, 11:49 PM
I felt like an alien after drinking that crazy ass beer!!

dogchow108
11-18-2004, 02:01 AM
well, they put the Pyramids here--- a wonder of design. why remove arafat- a wonder of political progressivism.

All joking aside tho, it was probably the Arafat-Killing Gnomes.

zachsan
11-18-2004, 01:34 PM
the gnomes?

there must be some heavy **** going down if they're involved.

dogchow108
11-18-2004, 02:09 PM
i know...i know...


i was hoping it wouldnt come down to this.

lester1/2jr
11-19-2004, 08:17 PM
George Bush is building a pyramid. cost thusfar: 200 billion.

dogchow108
11-20-2004, 08:40 AM
So, George Bush is an alien! it makes sense now.

zachsan
11-22-2004, 07:56 PM
this new forum is very crazy.

i suppose the eagles will have to stay at 8-1 in my title thing, because i can't figure out how to change that. but for the record, they're 9-1 now. go eagles!

shaolinstylee
11-22-2004, 08:16 PM
Zachsan, not too shabby.....

I'm a huge Donovan fan (Syracuse alumni).

I'm liking the new forum, and this thread has gone a little sideways.

zachsan
11-22-2004, 08:25 PM
damn it, i liked it better before i found out you have a higher Rep Power than me.

i don't know what that means, but it sounds important.

donovan is one crazy mother****er.

doc
11-22-2004, 08:26 PM
we'll have to figure out this rep power thing. And, there are comments that go along with it, lol...

shaolinstylee
11-22-2004, 08:34 PM
I've got crazy rep power..... Thats about it however.

zachsan
11-22-2004, 08:35 PM
it appears you're not the only one with crazy theories, doc.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6533186/

shaolinstylee
11-22-2004, 08:37 PM
I had a fealing that it wouldn't be long until his death caused a lot of finger pointing.

doc
11-27-2004, 12:10 AM
Al-Kidwa said toxicology tests were conducted but “no poisons known to doctors were found.”

He also said that the files gave no clear diagnosis for Arafat’s death on Nov. 11 in a Paris military hospital.



LOL... Damn, the Israeli's are smart.

dogchow108
11-29-2004, 02:30 AM
Al-Kidwa said toxicology tests were conducted but “no poisons known to doctors were found.”

He also said that the files gave no clear diagnosis for Arafat’s death on Nov. 11 in a Paris military hospital.



LOL... Damn, the Israeli's are smart.


We're GOOD, Doc, good. We're smart too but more importantly were good.

However, like ive said elsewhere, i am almost disappointed that ill never know for a fact WE got to kill the guy who wore a military uniform to get a Nobel Peace Prize and, as i understand it, addressed the UN with a gun on him.

doc
11-29-2004, 08:55 AM
We'll never know. For if we ever did, and you did, could you imagine the fallout? Best for everyone that no one ever finds out.

But, you know, and I know...

And now the French put on his death certificate that he was born in Jerusalem. Amazing.

dogchow108
11-29-2004, 02:32 PM
Nothing surprizing there...it goes without being said that France was one of Arafat's strongholds of support during his tenure as the Egyptian identity-theif leader of his people.

doc
12-11-2004, 06:19 PM
From MSNBC:

RAMALLAH, West Bank - Yasser Arafat’s nephew said Saturday the lack of a clear reason for his uncle’s death raised suspicions the Palestinian leader died of “unnatural” causes.

The comments by Nasser al-Kidwa, after he handed over the 558-page medical dossier to Palestinian officials in Ramallah, were certain to fuel speculation that Arafat was poisoned. Arafat died in a French hospital on Nov. 11.

Rumors and speculation among Palestinians and the broader Arab world that Arafat was poisoned could make it more difficult for a new leadership to take control. Palestinian presidential elections are scheduled for Jan. 9.

Al-Kidwa, who is also the Palestinian envoy to the United Nations, repeated his statement from last month that the French doctors were unable to rule out the possibility that Arafat had been poisoned, although they said they had not found traces of “any poison known to them.”

dogchow108
12-11-2004, 06:36 PM
No evidence of poisoning...then what the **** did they write a 600 page report on??


Even if the guy had been killed, the more i think about it the less it makes sense that Israel nailed him. The most likely killers of any Arab leader throughout Arab history have always been their own people.

shaolinstylee
12-11-2004, 08:10 PM
I was talking to someone the other day about this, and given the situation that Arrafat was in for like the last year, there is a good chance that one of his own took him out to have a change in situation for them. They were in a sticky situation with him still being the leader, and being basically cornered, where as a new guy could bring more out in change that in the same old story.

dogchow108
12-12-2004, 12:47 AM
Doc,

Unfortunately, the problem with people like Arafat is that they usually create one of the folloiwing two situations should they ever "depart" for whatever reason:

1- make their personal existence essential to the government, thus making any reform difficult at best, and also making it to where if they leave, then theres a problem with picking up from where everything was left off. take for example, when this whole health thing started, the desperate- and failed- scramble by the people in charge now to convice Arafat to give them control of the PA's money. You think Suha kept that old, decrepit, ugly disgusting bastard alive because she cared about him? That life support might as well have been attatched to her bank.

or

2- make sure their legacy rings in the hearts of the next generations. And THIS is where most of the fear of the skeptics lies. This is why you will hear the pessimistic in Israel say that it wont make a difference. While the US is quick to allocate $20 million to the PA to pull them out of money debts- money that is more likely to actually go into good use this time I must admit, The problem of ideology cannot be solved as easily when infants are taught to kill, and elementary school kids are taught to want to die.

Personally, i prefer we have the troubles brought on by the first thing than by the second one. Arafat was, undoubtably, a cold blooded mass-murderer. I am disgusted that the Israeli govt ever gave him a second thought, but thats just how it went. He was also without a doubt the most major obstacle to peace between the Israelis and the Palestinians EVER. But, after the circus he led, I dont expect his removal to jump-start things so quickly- although it's a start.

shaolinstylee
12-13-2004, 03:11 AM
Good point Dogchow... where do you think this is going to lead in the next 5 years?

dogchow108
12-13-2004, 04:43 AM
Well, personally i have no clue. I think there's pleny of people who probably are 100% convinced that this was the major tree in the middle of the road that just got lifted. And on the other hand there's people who are 100% convinced that the Israelis made Arafat to be a major problem when he was not really. Though one side of this has always struck me as less convincing than the other, they both have made good points.

The Israeli government is still a very stubborn institution, and you have to keep in mind it is a Jewish government, with Jewish interests., which leads often to ambiguities. For example, in my opinion, one of the places where Israeli policy has fallen short is in the effort to remove settlers.
I think they need to be removed from areas that are on the negotiating tables, regardless of the legality issue (which believe me is not always as obvious as the press sometimes makes it out to be).
The problem, having said that, is that this would be a failure on behalf of the Israeli government to act for Jewish interest (which, as an item on the agenda of the government of the only Jewish state in the world, should be its top priority and has every right to be). Not so much because they are "uprooting Jews from Jewish land", but because this falls in plan with a clearly, unambigously stated PLO objective to cleanse the middle east of Jewish autonomy. You have to understand that the PLO was not made to create a Palestinian state- it was made to destroy the Jewish one. If you EVER have any doubts about that, read the PLO charter for one. I'm not even tlaking about Fateh, Hamas, Palestinian Islamic Jihad--- i'm talking about the people Israel is expected to go to the negotiating tables with. The Palestinians cannot ask for both removal of settlers AND a "right" to return to what is now Israel- that simply wont fly.

There's more to this, of course, but you see my point is that every issue has kind of 3 and a half points of view here. There is a genuine Right and Left wing in Israel, and this majorly divides Israeli concensus on this. On the Other hand, the PA is still a primitive totalitarian government, which one can hardly say has afforded its people the kind of dichotomy in thought that Israeli public has had. Not only dont i think its not fair to say the Palestinians have only 1.5 views, i actually think would be unfair to say they do because that kills any future chance they ever really will have that luxury.

Drawing then, that Israeli public concensus is the major driving force behind the actions of the Israeli government, one can maybe understand why the death of Arafat has not exactly unlocked any hidden vaults (both literally and figuratively speaking). Sharon is in a very delicate situation. If there's anything this past term should ahve taugt him is that he can go to sleep agreed with and wake up the next morning with a crisis in his government.

In my opinion, we really need to wait for the water to clear in the PA (which i am not holding my breath for), and then start making speculations. I understand that Marwan Bargouti has given up his race for the Palestinian elections, something which i feel will help in the long run. But you have to understand how insignificant something so seemingly significant really is. From my perspective, we are talking about a culture which to its very core is hostile to Israel. You would have a very hard time convinging me that the Palestinians have been as tolerant, be it politics, general public concensus, education, on and on and on... as Israelis have been with them. Its just much easier for Palestinians to look more unified and organized when there is only one voice allowed.

We'll see.

LeiYunFat
12-13-2004, 05:25 AM
We'll see.


That is what I read.

shaolinstylee
12-13-2004, 05:26 AM
Thanks for the post. I've sort of taken a wait and see attitude with this myself, as I think you can't really speculate much until they have a new leader, and see what direction he goes in.

dogchow108
12-13-2004, 06:00 AM
Emphasis on He

shaolinstylee
12-13-2004, 06:03 AM
Well, it's not like we've (we being the US) elected a crap load of woman, but just give it a few years.. there will be a good chance we may have our first canidate for pres. that might actually me mestral.

dogchow108
12-13-2004, 06:24 AM
Well, one of Israel's first prime-ministers was a woman. Golda Meir. Man, now she kicked ass...


I find it Ironic though that during Israel's more "archaic" times we had a woman PM, and now not. weird.

shaolinstylee
12-13-2004, 06:30 AM
Oh, well, I was talking about the PLO, but yeah. I think when the time is right, it may happen. Either way, the whole Isreal, PLO, and the rest of the middle east should be interesting in the next few months as we have these elections coming up.

liutangsanzang
05-02-2009, 11:58 AM
Quite a lot of insults on Arafat

I ve never heard Thich Nhat Hanh insulting Kissinger

As for dogchow and friends analysis on how palestinians are full of hatred and raise their kids to kill while israel is moderate, the figure of people killed in the last 9 years kind of prove that it is israel who kills more. But r figures objective?

Hippie peace and love

dogchow108
05-02-2009, 05:11 PM
The numbers also show that the Palestinians enjoy dying more than the Israelis.

I wonder if there is anything in their cultural rhetoric that might influence them to feel that way...

liutangsanzang
05-03-2009, 02:52 PM
These days in order to find solutions to the afghan/pakistan/kashmir problem i watch a retreat Thich Nhat Hanh made for israelian and palestinians. With his experience of vietnam war and his desire to solve it trough non violence he knows a bit what he talks about.

He says that one mistake is to want to persuade the so called enemy, to call for unity according to our desire. He says the right path is to get inside us and cultivate the seeds of comprehension, compassion, understanding other suffering, peace. We should not insult or speak bad about the other one but understand with love, see the suffering. He says that in us we have peace and we must get in contact with that. The peace process should not be political but human peace process.

Thich Nhat Hanh says we should write a love letter to the other, make a friend of him...


Peace and love

master splinter
05-04-2009, 04:13 AM
Well its been said before. The English language doesn't really provide a very useful definiton for love, in the sense that you are using it. But i do believe that respect and appreciation, as well as a little sympathy can work wonders for the world.

mbokohutu
05-05-2009, 03:01 AM
Thich Nhat Hanh says we should write a love letter to the other, make a friend of him...

Peace and love

Is Thich Nhat Hanh busy?

I would love to see him go to Israel, enter Gaza or the west bank dressed as a Palestinian, and go tell an Israeli soldier that he loves him.

Thich would get about 500 yards from the Israeli soldier, and the Israeli soldier would shoot him.

Does Thich say if you write a letter to a cold blooded killer, will they still respond to your love and compassion?

mbokohutu
05-05-2009, 03:06 AM
The numbers also show that the Palestinians enjoy dying more than the Israelis.

I wonder if there is anything in their cultural rhetoric that might influence them to feel that way...

What is it like to be a monster? Do you drool at the thought of dead bodies? Do you laugh when you see bleeding people with parts blown off of them?

What made you decide Satan would be your master?

dogchow108
05-05-2009, 04:25 AM
Is Thich Nhat Hanh busy?

I would love to see him go to Israel, enter Gaza or the west bank dressed as a Palestinian, and go tell an Israeli soldier that he loves him.

Thich would get about 500 yards from the Israeli soldier, and the Israeli soldier would shoot him.

Does Thich say if you write a letter to a cold blooded killer, will they still respond to your love and compassion?

Better yet, he should go to the territories dressed as an Israeli and tell the PA he loves them.


What is it like to be a monster? Do you drool at the thought of dead bodies? Do you laugh when you see bleeding people with parts blown off of them?

What made you decide Satan would be your master?

It's great. I wear a baby mask and run around yelling "Die Die Die".


As a rule of thumb, I don't buy into Islamic/Christian mythology but I would imagine there is pretty solid evidence of Satan's grasp on this world's people when someone like Arafat wins a Nobel Peace Prize.

liutangsanzang
05-05-2009, 05:28 AM
Mobutu,

well Thich Nhat Hanh wrote love letters to americans and vietminh and it kind of worked... Why u dont wantto see the beautiful side of reality and stay in ur paranoia?

Peace and love

doc
05-05-2009, 06:26 AM
It did?

Hanh helped end the Vietnam war? Got more information on that?

I'd LOVE to see that...

liutangsanzang
05-05-2009, 06:39 AM
Well, that is what i heard。Wasnt it on the list for nobel peace prize?

He often says when people asked if he was coming from north or south vietnam he replied he was coming from the center...

U can do search on emule。The israelian palestinian retreat is interesting, it is abbreviated IPR。

I m not saying he is the great master, but i like to learn from him

mbokohutu
05-16-2009, 07:51 AM
It's great. I wear a baby mask and run around yelling "Die Die Die".

All it took to get you to work for Satan was a baby mask and permission to run around yelling Die Die Die?

Jeez. You're easy.



As a rule of thumb, I don't buy into Islamic/Christian mythology but I would imagine there is pretty solid evidence of Satan's grasp on this world's people when someone like Arafat wins a Nobel Peace Prize.

The only thing you need to do to find evidence of Satan's grasp on this world is to read your own posts.

mbokohutu
05-16-2009, 07:52 AM
Mobutu,

well Thich Nhat Hanh wrote love letters to americans and vietminh and it kind of worked... Why u dont wantto see the beautiful side of reality and stay in ur paranoia?

Peace and love

Hey Psychotic?

Boo!!!!!!!!!!

Go Away!!!!!!!!!!

I am not a nice guy to psychotics like Doc is. I kick psychotics because psychosis is contagious.

dogchow108
05-16-2009, 02:50 PM
Mbokohutu, I can understand your hostility to psychotics. A mirror can be a tough think to look into sometimes.

liutangsanzang
05-18-2009, 07:56 AM
Mobutu,

apparently u r not a big believer of budism. When u will die and all ur agressivity will appear, i m not sure where it will bring u, but u should be aware it will probably bring u to places where there is suffering

Again, cultivate calm, peace, love, kind words, that will help u.

As for psychosis, i think it is always interesting to see all these people call other people mad but do nothing to help them. I guess the idea of compassion to end suffering has not gone deep inside.

Anyway dont worry i will try help u with our vegetarian circus, but i am afraid u will have difficult reincarnations if u dont calm down, that, no one can help u, u will rebirth according ur karma probably

Peace and love

mbokohutu
07-07-2009, 04:36 PM
Mobutu,

Peace and love

Liu. Your crazyness is a plot, an act, a method. I know all about what you are trying to do.

Let me elucidate for others.

What Liu does is talk craziness or talk something other than the subject at hand to divert people. If you take a thinking, rational, intellectual person who is trying to discuss something, and you talk insanity or other subjects to them while maintaining the facade of an attentive intelligence actually interested in the conversation, the other person will eventually quit.

Intelligence is no match for craziness. Intelligence will lose every time. Intelligence can not make sense of craziness, so it breaks up. When the intelligence breaks up, their goes the intelligent conversation.

The human manipulation methods being used by Liu are meant to be used to help people advance to a higher level in this world. You selfish misusing of them for worthless goals like playing on internet forums is a perversion of these methods and an insult to there proper use.

I would make a recommendation for you to do something, but a person who misuses holy kinds of tools for their own selfish interest is not going to do anything that is morally right.

liutangsanzang
07-08-2009, 03:19 PM
In sanskrit bodhi is intellect but from ur stanza i think u miss the goal of non violence 4 every beings such as animals, humans, ghosts by thinking too much of intelligence

What u call madness in budism is ignorance, it is not non sense.

And sense there is, it is called non violence and love, i think.

Focus ur mind on non violence, i guess u will see how things have a logic

master splinter
07-09-2009, 07:08 AM
The human manipulation methods being used by Liu are meant to be used to help people advance to a higher level in this world. You selfish misusing of them for worthless goals like playing on internet forums is a perversion of these methods and an insult to there proper use.

I would make a recommendation for you to do something, but a person who misuses holy kinds of tools for their own selfish interest is not going to do anything that is morally right.

Wtf? lmao...

master splinter
07-09-2009, 07:20 AM
In sanskrit bodhi is intellect but from ur stanza i think u miss the goal of non violence 4 every beings such as animals, humans, ghosts by thinking too much of intelligence

What u call madness in budism is ignorance, it is not non sense.

And sense there is, it is called non violence and love, i think.

Focus ur mind on non violence, i guess u will see how things have a logic


Just because im getting tired of hearing you repeat yourself over and over, I have your answer.

Nonviolence relies on violence to exist, suffering is due to greed, and ignorance. Meditate on that... And no. This statement is not open to argument.

Dont waste your time studying scriptures, if you are not willing to encompass the whole truth. Violence is real, and it isnt going to go anywhere anytime soon. Self defense requires violence. Nonviolence will only get you killed, against violence. If you are that stupid, and willing to die, then fine. Nonviolence is great and all, but its unrealistic in times of danger. So quit it already with the nonviolence, vegetarian bullshit.

Vegetables are made of the same basic cells that meat are made out of, so when you eat a plant, you are killing the same type of cells as you would be when you are eating meat.

Plants have consciousness, they make efforts to survive, they eat, drink, they are alive, they respond to stimuli... so you are still killing life when you eat plants. Its just a life that you are more comfortable killing, and eating, because you are "fixated" on animals, etc.

Its like listening to a broken record, "dont harm animals" "end world suffering"... I appreciate honesty, so i will be honest... okay, To be honest. It just gets annoying. Period. Its just irritating. Stop it. Just stop.... You will get nowhere thinking like this...

Stop being retarded or you will be flamed like mhoto, lowbacca and maestro.

liutangsanzang
07-10-2009, 05:22 AM
U seem 2 suffer. Indeed understanding violence and suffering can create suffering at the beginning. Some might say it is non sense

Budism would tell u u should not suffer from violence and see u r the own cause of ur suffering, for instance trough attachment

I dont know. Do u master the kalama sutta about the necesity to doubt ur own thinking?

Peace and love

Fu Jow Pai
07-10-2009, 08:28 AM
HA HA HA HA HA!

Fu Jow Pai
07-10-2009, 08:37 AM
HEY! Hi!
Peace and love.

Has everyone forgotten what Israel were up to earlier on this year?

mankind is evil. the leaders of men are not handed their positions from a god.
We allow them that responsibility.

And most of the time our governments **** us over.

Which western country has not committed some form of atrocity?

Mr Arafat was a leader, that is all. With the shit western society has pulled in the past i don't think we should really be commenting on the middle east.

And splinter is right, the only time non violence will actually ever exist is when all governments go communist. however that plan is also flawed.....

Plus, i kinda like it.

zachsan
07-10-2009, 03:50 PM
When did Liu stop signing off with "Hippy peace and love"? I miss that.

liutangsanzang
07-15-2009, 03:17 PM
Violence is a hell of complicated problem

Lets say u believe in ghosts or reincarnatiom ( i aint saying true or false). If the cia supported the talibans some years ago and these people r not judged, expect them to do the same thing in the future. Same with Pinochet or Kissinger. Hope they wont kill me for telling that!

I think need to clean more and judge and help the people who made mistakes in the us in the recent past...

Hippie peace and love