"they have a lot in common and many more similarities than differences"

[onesp1ng]

does it make a specific difference in how china will interact with tibet and the rest of the world in, let's say, the next five years?

does it make a difference in terms of humanity, by assisting to educate and challenge the ignorance that is abundant in old, stereotypical ways of viewing our situation on earth?

[Fa Hui]

does it make a specific difference in how china will interact with tibet and the rest of the world in, let's say, the next five years?

does it make a difference in terms of humanity, by assisting to educate and challenge the ignorance that is abundant in old, stereotypical ways of viewing our situation on earth?

One person at a time may be the only way to do at this moment until they all start getting the idea...if that ever happens....

[blooming tianshi lotus]

[quote onesp1ng]

Caught in the Middle, Called a Traitor

By Grace Wang
Sunday, April 20, 2008; B01

I study languages -- Italian, French and German. And this summer -- now that it looks as though I won't be able to go home to China -- I'll take up Arabic. My goal is to master 10 languages, in addition to Chinese and English, by the time I'm 30.

I want to do this because I believe that language is the bridge to understanding. Take China and Tibet. If more Chinese learned the Tibetan language, and if Tibetans learned more about China, I'm convinced that our two peoples would understand one another better and we could overcome the current crisis between us peacefully. I feel that even more strongly after what happened here at Duke University a little more than a week ago.

Trying to mediate between Chinese and pro-Tibetan campus protesters, I was caught in the middle and vilified and threatened by the Chinese. After the protest, the intimidation continued online, and I began receiving threatening phone calls. Then it got worse -- my parents in China were also threatened and forced to go into hiding. And I became persona non grata in my native country.

It has been a frightening and unsettling experience. But I'm determined to speak out, even in the face of threats and abuse. If I stay silent, then the same thing will happen to someone else someday.

So here's my story.

When I first arrived at Duke last August, I was afraid I wouldn't like it. It's in the small town of Durham, N.C., and I'm from Qingdao, a city of 4.3 million. But I eventually adjusted, and now I really love it. It's a diverse environment, with people from all over the world. Over Christmas break, all the American students went home, but that's too expensive for students from China. Since the dorms and the dining halls were closed, I was housed off-campus with four Tibetan classmates for more than three weeks.

I had never really met or talked to a Tibetan before, even though we're from the same country. Every day we cooked together, ate together, played chess and cards. And of course, we talked about our different experiences growing up on opposite sides of the People's Republic of China. It was eye-opening for me.

I'd long been interested in Tibet and had a romantic vision of the Land of Snows, but I'd never been there. Now I learned that the Tibetans have a different way of seeing the world. My classmates were Buddhist and had a strong faith, which inspired me to reflect on my own views about the meaning of life. I had been a materialist, as all Chinese are taught to be, but now I could see that there's something more, that there's a spiritual side to life.

We talked a lot in those three weeks, and of course we spoke in Chinese. The Tibetan language isn't the language of instruction in the better secondary schools there and is in danger of disappearing. Tibetans must be educated in Mandarin Chinese to succeed in our extremely capitalistic culture. This made me sad, and made me want to learn their language as they had learned mine.

I was reminded of all this on the evening of April 9. As I left the cafeteria planning to head to the library to study, I saw people holding Tibetan and Chinese flags facing each other in the middle of the quad. I hadn't heard anything about a protest, so I was curious and went to have a look. I knew people in both groups, and I went back and forth between them, asking their views. It seemed silly to me that they were standing apart, not talking to each other. I know that this is often due to a language barrier, as many Chinese here are scientists and engineers and aren't confident of their English.

I thought I'd try to get the two groups together and initiate some dialogue, try to get everybody thinking from a broader perspective. That's what Lao Tzu, Sun Tzu and Confucius remind us to do. And I'd learned from my dad early on that disagreement is nothing to be afraid of. Unfortunately, there's a strong Chinese view nowadays that critical thinking and dissidence create problems, so everyone should just keep quiet and maintain harmony.

A lot has been made of the fact that I wrote the words "Free Tibet" on the back of the American organizer of the protest, who was someone I knew. But I did this at his request, and only after making him promise that he would talk to the Chinese group. I never dreamed how the Chinese would seize on this innocent action. The leaders of the two groups did at one point try to communicate, but the attempt wasn't very successful.

The Chinese protesters thought that, being Chinese, I should be on their side. The participants on the Tibet side were mostly Americans, who really don't have a good understanding of how complex the situation is. Truthfully, both sides were being quite closed-minded and refusing to consider the other's perspective. I thought I could help try to turn a shouting match into an exchange of ideas. So I stood in the middle and urged both sides to come together in peace and mutual respect. I believe that they have a lot in common and many more similarities than differences.

But the Chinese protesters -- who were much more numerous, maybe 100 or more -- got increasingly emotional and vocal and wouldn't let the other side speak. They pushed the small Tibetan group of just a dozen or so up against the Duke Chapel doors, yelling "Liars, liars, liars!" This upset me. It was so aggressive, and all Chinese know the moral injunction: Junzi dongkou, bu dongshou (The wise person uses his tongue, not his fists).

I was scared. But I believed that I had to try to promote mutual understanding. I went back and forth between the two groups, mostly talking to the Chinese in our language. I kept urging everyone to calm down, but it only seemed to make them angrier. Some young men in the Chinese group -- those we call fen qing (angry youth) -- started yelling and cursing at me.

What a lot of people don't know is that there were many on the Chinese side who supported me and were saying, "Let her talk." But they were drowned out by the loud minority who had really lost their cool.

Some people on the Chinese side started to insult me for speaking English and told me to speak Chinese only. But the Americans didn't understand Chinese. It's strange to me that some Chinese seem to feel as though not speaking English is expressing a kind of national pride. But language is a tool, a way of thinking and communicating.

At the height of the protest, a group of Chinese men surrounded me, pointed at me and, referring to the young woman who led the 1989 student democracy protests in Tiananmen Square, said, "Remember Chai Ling? All Chinese want to burn her in oil, and you look like her." They said that I had mental problems and that I would go to hell. They asked me where I was from and what school I had attended. I told them. I had nothing to hide. But then it started to feel as though an angry mob was about to attack me. Finally, I left the protest with a police escort.

Back in my dorm room, I logged onto the Duke Chinese Students and Scholars Association (DCSSA) Web site and listserv to see what people were saying. Qian Fangzhou, an officer of DCSSA, was gloating, "We really showed them our colors!"

I posted a letter in response, explaining that I don't support Tibetan independence, as some accused me of, but that I do support Tibetan freedom, as well as Chinese freedom. All people should be free and have their basic rights protected, just as the Chinese constitution says. I hoped that the letter would spark some substantive discussion. But people just criticized and ridiculed me more.

The next morning, a storm was raging online. Photographs of me had been posted on the Internet with the words "Traitor to her country!" printed across my forehead. Then I saw something really alarming: Both my parents' citizen ID numbers had been posted. I was shocked, because this information could only have come from the Chinese police.

I saw detailed directions to my parents' home in China, accompanied by calls for people to go there and teach "this shameless dog" a lesson. It was then that I realized how serious this had become. My phone rang with callers making threats against my life. It was ironic: What I had tried so hard to prevent was precisely what had come to pass. And I was the target.

I talked to my mom the next morning, and she said that she and my dad were going into hiding because they were getting death threats, too. She told me that I shouldn't call them. Since then, short e-mail messages have been our only communication. The other day, I saw photos of our apartment online; a bucket of feces had been emptied on the doorstep. More recently I've heard that the windows have been smashed and obscene posters have been hung on the door. Also, I've been told that after convening an assembly to condemn me, my high school revoked my diploma and has reinforced patriotic education.

I understand why people are so emotional and angry; the events in Tibet have been tragic. But this crucifying of me is unacceptable. I believe that individual Chinese know this. It's when they fire each other up and act like a mob that things get so dangerous.

Now, Duke is providing me with police protection, and the attacks in Chinese cyberspace continue. But contrary to my detractors' expectations, I haven't shriveled up and slunk away. Instead, I've responded by publicizing this shameful incident, both to protect my parents and to get people to reflect on their behavior. I'm no longer afraid, and I'm determined to exercise my right to free speech.

Because language is the bridge to understanding.
[end quote]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...802635_pf.html

Okay. Let me try this again.

Firstly, I think that it was probably an innocent attempt on part of the author, but, I think she may have bitten off more than she could chew. I wouldn't have become involved and then been sore about repercussions. not in recent yrs at least, and certainly not where that it was all that I was doing about it in terms of noise anyway. duh.


I wouldn't have written on his back neither, because I dont support that as it stands, so I wouldn't like to wager on getting involved like that. she says that her action was innocent, when it was clearly participative in the protest, but then says that they are guiltly for protesting about her protest.
She agreed to add that fuel of her own free will, and when it caught fire, she totally dismissed her role in that and instead blamed the wood.
the eightfold path is very clear about that what constitutes right action and focus.
She also blames china and the rest of the world for not studying tibetan language, or to be generous, the situation where that's her idea of a solution, but does she teach tibetan langauage or has she approached a government body to offer her idea about that? there are ways and means of doing things, and I dont agree with that type of display in any other capacity than that I think she's young an doesn't know any better. apparently that realisation opportunity, or principal even, is knocking at her door currently. If language is a bridge, then how effective was that bridge for her?
Would we have the whole world ordered to take mandatory classes in every single language and dialect in the world to create peace? and yet she claims to not be in support of communism.
why dont we bring the nazis back in to power. gee, I wonder what penalty of occassioned violence could be the result of not conforming or dong well at such a thing.


I also think it's easy to get on a high horse of protest and admit that our previous selves have been materialistic, and we no longer are having been liberated from that, when our own financial futures are looking soldily on the increase, when the other party's isn't. and now her degrees mayn't be legitimate because she no longer holds a high school certificate? Our stories have alot in common on alot of levels, I think.

I also believe that ppl fire up like that where there is lack of reasonable solution, and do that out of group hysteria. I can see that she cites the chinese constitution. I wouldn't hate to see that tabled at the UN and accompanying a practical solution, and really, I can empathathise with being young and not thinking through my actions or coming up short for any particular point, but, as one gets older and experiences enough rounds of that type of a cycle, one might also then see how such a thing can definately can act as a transformation platform for something else to rise out of...


Free speech is good and well, but being wise enough to work out where to use it, like in the UN for myself, is a whole other thing altogether. I say go straight for the guts of it and take it to the infrastructure. that's what some of us are doing while they're out there making noise and fighting about it anyway.

Godspeed to her.

Blooming tianshi lotus.

[onesp1ng]

we're not talking about you or what you would do, bl.

i'll suggest those interested start reading more about what actual Chinese say and think, about this, and other topics. remember, this girl has a completely different upbringing, background, and education.

here bl, if you still desire to talk about yourself, register in the forum below...and tell everyone what you would do if you were them... please, have at em... lol...

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/

[blooming tianshi lotus]

I was only demonstrating the difference. Imo it may as well have been an active jihad display. If that's her choice, then okay. like ppl weren't already in the process of implenting other plans where they would have a real infrastucturally integratable chance..like with laws and governing education bodies via an actual suggestion, onesp1ng. we've had this discussion here already about earning a right to be heard about this sort of thing and how to go about that and why.

I doo think it's immature to carry on like that in any capacity instigating situation where a real solution isn't also provided with it...and, ..as I said, I wouldn't do it. tf kind of b.s. is that?
you know the joke about the big mouthed frog eats flys and insects until it runs across something that big mouthed frogs and suddenly hasn't seen many of those around lately? well, something like that.
I meditated for the bali bombers souls too but that doesn't mean I condoned what they did.


I also found your sri lanka pm reference. that doesn't neccessarily mean it's exculsive to the existance of another one telling me about the wonders of pali and sanskrit, but there you go. I admit it. you did say you were emotionally invested about it, so there you have it.


Blooming tianshi lotus.

[onesp1ng]

I also found your sri lanka pm reference. that doesn't neccessarily mean it's exculsive to the existance of another one telling me about the wonders of pali and sanskrit, but there you go. I admit it.

whao, look at that. i actually remember what i said. and that means bl misquoted me...../.... or did she...?

no, she would never do that......lol.....

it's me....it's got to be....

[blooming tianshi lotus]

You dont think sanskrit or pali are beautiful?

I think they're all beautiful. and humorous, because they have a funny target audience. I also laughed ol when I read the bible and the tora. I think that kind of thing is sweet. I also enjoy aboriginal and tribal dreamtime stories, but whatever.

I dont not remember you appreciating both of those, but whatever. at least I make effort to 'clear your name' about it.

I dont get your criticism.

Blooming tianshi lotus.

[onesp1ng]

i'm glad you enjoy such things.

the point was that i knew i didn't say that, and you assured me that i had. that's it.

and then, even when admitting you misquoted me, you still protected yourself by saying the opposite could be true. i mean, should i thank you for making the effort even when you still insist that i potentially said what you thought i said...?

yes, that was very big you.

[blooming tianshi lotus]

No. You needn't thank me!..

that's silly.

giddiness isn't where I'm coming from saying that, but I cant see proof of your actual words about pali an sanskrit but I remember you telling me about it and me thinking along the lines of how good you made it sound, and enough to investigate for myself.

If you say you hate it and always hated it, and it's ugly and nOt beautiful or whatever, and cannot find beauty and appreciation in how your thought process came together and for each and every part of the stuff that influenced it, then.. okay. new topic is karmic appreciation.

I'm okay with you at this at distance. are you okay with that?


Blooming tianshi lotus.

[onesp1ng]

If you say you hate it and always hated it, and it's ugly and nOt beautiful or whatever, and cannot find beauty and appreciation in how your thought process came together and for each and every part of the stuff that influenced it, then.. okay.

why, did i say this? (geez, age must be catching up to me fast).

please, you must tell me......

[blooming tianshi lotus]

What you said about it recently was that you'd never say that that pali or sanskrit were beautiful languages.

Back to the bike incident though, it basically boils down to the same thing as what I said there, and that just reconfirms it. You seem a little emotional still the way you're carrying on, so you just go ahead and run whatever emotions you need to. apparently, so the proverb goes, if we can just amuse ourselves ( and tolerate growing pains and evolution points in the meantime) ( and staying proactive would help) then time will do it's thing and it'll all sort itself out anyway. consecrated to the cycle whether we like it or not. If buddha didn't see you coming in that state and find peace about it or however it turns out for you personally and the entire cycle collectively, then I'll be f*cked.

you're being a sh*thead, but, whatever you need to do. People behaving badly is nothing new , Onesp1ng. go for your life. there there, love.

Blooming tianshi lotus.

[onesp1ng]

you'd never say that that pali or sanskrit were beautiful languages

wow, i think this is the first time in recent days that you didn't extrapolate nonsense from your own imagination.

actually, however, what was said was that i would have never said that (to you). not that i would never say that, but that i would have never said that, which, again, implies two different meanings. but this time it was a misunderstanding, not a misquote.

Back to the bike incident though, it basically boils down to the same thing as what I said there, and that just reconfirms it. You seem a little emotional still the way you're carrying on, so you just go ahead and run whatever emotions you need to. apparently, so the proverb goes, if we can just amuse ourselves ( and tolerate growing pains and evolution points in the meantime) ( and staying proactive would help) then time will do it's thing and it'll all sort itself out anyway. consecrated to the cycle whether we like it or not. If buddha didn't see you coming in that state and find peace about it or however it turns out for you personally and the entire cycle collectively, then I'll be f*cked.

oops, there you go again....off to the races.....

------

and, btw, please don't preach buddha jargon to me. i'm not buddhist.

[blooming tianshi lotus]

why not. you preach your own personal hermenuetic and belief system.

I dont care whatever you want to pretend you did and didn't say to me, or how you pretend to perceive what I do and dont say. it's all time wasting semantic garbage.


I dont care if you like what I do and I dont care if you approve of who I am. ..aand , your mean and juvenielle behaviour lately, only serves to reeally make me understand that you've got some shit going on and need some space to find yourself over it. do it and be on the other side of it, or dont do it and dont. I'm tired doing that for myownself and that's my priority. not your affection or approval. it's your ball, youu run the fu*cking thing up whatever it is or isn't about, or dont and it's still all good. I cant get in your body and do it for you, so if we're repelling each other right now, just let thaat be .
I think it's part of the process. relax with that.





Blooming tianshi lotus.