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  • New look in Shaolin?

    Hope this ladyboy thing doesn't catch on.

  • #2
    puckering monks with mascara and eyeliner, my noose is ready...
    "Life is a run. In attack we run, in defense we run. When you can no longer run, time to die" - Shichiroji "Seven samurai"

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    • #3
      Well, what do you expect when the boss does things like this: http://www.russbo.org/vb/showthread.php?t=2721
      Experienced Community organizer. Yeah, let's choose him to run the free world. It will be historic. What could possibly go wrong...

      "You're just a jaded cynical mother****er...." Jeffpeg

      (more comments in my User Profile)
      russbo.com


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      • #4
        i could maybe hack the mascara if their thumbs were at least tucked in.

        jeez. has even shaolin turned fanook...brokeback shaolin...
        "Arhat, I am your father..."
        -the Dark Lord Cod

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        • #5
          WTF is this SHIT? It's just a bunch of whored-up chinese boys without any shirts. Chinese Opera meets Chippendales?
          Becoming what I've dreamed about.

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          • #6
            Well, if you remember a few years back, I reported on the more theatrical movements of Shaolin, with respect to Shi De Yang's school. I put some videos of that up, in the Video Library. Damn, it must have been now, three maybe four years ago???

            Wrote about this change somewhere... Journals, or Topics, something about the modern evolution (or devolution?) of gong fu....
            Experienced Community organizer. Yeah, let's choose him to run the free world. It will be historic. What could possibly go wrong...

            "You're just a jaded cynical mother****er...." Jeffpeg

            (more comments in my User Profile)
            russbo.com


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            • #7
              the goings on of shaolin have nothing to do with the evolution of gung fu or shaolin gung fu for that matter

              more like the devolution of shaolin temple and thats about it, and thats nothing new

              theres plenty of real shaolin practitioners who would lay waste to these fag wushu monks, plenty of whom never trained in so called "shaolin temple" wushu
              "did you ask me to consider dick with you??" blooming tianshi lotus

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              • #8
                Originally posted by doc
                Well, if you remember a few years back, I reported on the more theatrical movements of Shaolin, with respect to Shi De Yang's school. I put some videos of that up, in the Video Library. Damn, it must have been now, three maybe four years ago???

                Wrote about this change somewhere... Journals, or Topics, something about the modern evolution (or devolution?) of gong fu....
                i remember those vids all too well. but I don't think dy was really "into" it. never really heard anything more about it but I wasn't exactly biting my nails in excitement over it either...i let it gracefully slip off my radar screen like the xh uniforms and belt systems.
                "Arhat, I am your father..."
                -the Dark Lord Cod

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                • #9
                  DY was "into it". He was quite proud of what his students could do. It was all very theatrical, and, don't forget, DY was the big boss of his wushu team at that time.

                  It's all related. The theatricalness of what Shaolin is doing was first explored in that ridiculous documentary I was in. They had excellent points to make, but their execution was amateurish, which was unfortunate. They made mention of the changes, via their discussion that included me, XingHong, and what was going on in the Zengzhou festival.
                  Experienced Community organizer. Yeah, let's choose him to run the free world. It will be historic. What could possibly go wrong...

                  "You're just a jaded cynical mother****er...." Jeffpeg

                  (more comments in my User Profile)
                  russbo.com


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                  • #10
                    well he may have been into it, but the last time I saw him it seemed like it went nowhere fast...I could be wrong of course and hope fervently I am not, lol...

                    who the hell can know though, some of the goofiest shit in the world is cool in china that much is obvious.

                    if I ever see toad or scorpion or worse that fuçking frog form ever again I will remove my own spleen and burn it in the inferno for a permanent ban.
                    "Arhat, I am your father..."
                    -the Dark Lord Cod

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by doc
                      Well, what do you expect when the boss does things like this: http://www.russbo.org/vb/showthread.php?t=2721
                      I have read this clause(article) about Russia. I personally saw that monk Shi Yong Been in Moscow teaches. It is a circus! But it(he) does not teach the present martial arts. It(he) still teaches and Tai-chi Shaolin!!!!! On measurement of Moscow money for trainings huge for these employment(occupations). In Russia now there is a destruction of the present(true) military art, destruction of serious trainers martial arts. To the qualified teachers do not give to work, and to teachers - falsifiers - an open way to enrichment. Now in Russia and Ukraine propagation of synthesis martial arts with christianity, with doctrine Castaneda, with cowardice and weakness. In result many people are engaged martial arts, but they pass by violence, they escape from the robber, they do not battle. And it now at us refers to as " art of the soldier "!!!! Very popularly now in Russia and Ukraine sects with practice kung-fu and anal sex, debauch, with предательсвом relatives and friends. Now cowardice teach as heroism! 15 years ago, 5 years ago it did not exist in my country!!!! It is a part of a policy(politics) on disinformation of true values of the soldier, boldness, aspiration to freedom and the truth. It is my response.

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                      • #12
                        *must wash eyes*..........
                        http://americanshaolinkungfu.org/3.html

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                        • #13
                          Monks and Maskara - Something to Ponder

                          Here is a question for everyone involved in this thread so far:

                          Could it be that there is a movement going back towards the origin involved here?

                          To back this question up some, below you will find an extract of my first Chapter on my Shaolin book which is currently being finalized. The numbers in brackets are literary references listed at the end.

                          /////////////////////////////////////////////////Start////////////////////////////////////////

                          Some martial arts enthusiasts themselves admit that "the relationship between the martial arts and entertainment has a long history in China." [63] Martial entertainments are known from the beginning of the written record. One of China's oldest books, the Book of Songs, documents an early division of theatrical performances into civil and military; the Rites of Chou describes a "dance with bows and arrows"; and texts and stone reliefs from the Hah dynasty attest to martial acrobatic performances. [64] These intertwined traditions of theater and the martial arts came together in their most peculiar form in the "butting game" (chiao-ti hsi) of the Ch'in and Han dynasties.

                          The eighteenth century T'u-shu chi-ch'eng, an encyclopedia in 10,000 sections (chuan) that is one of the largest and most complete ever compiled anywhere, lists this butting game as its first entry under the subject of boxing. In the original form of this game, people donned cow's horns and butted one another, in commemoration of a mythological event from the time of the Yellow Emperor. [65] Eventually, however, it became a generic name referring to games of combat such as wrestling, acrobatics and other assorted forms of entertainment. This transformation was in progress in 209 B.C., when the second emperor of Ch'in "made merry with games of butting and comedic actors." In this, one of their earliest manifestations, the martial arts appear to have taken the form of faintly ridiculous entertainment. [66]

                          When true drama evolved in China during the Sung (960-1279) and Yuan (1279-1368) dynasties, military entertainments composed a popular part of the new theatrical tradition. Stage-fighting was a principal attraction in the famous Peking Opera of the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries, and fantastic acrobatic feats were a regular and expected part of performances. [67]

                          Robert Fortune, an Englishman, witnessed one such performance in rural China sometime between 1853 and 1856, and left the following account:

                          An actor rushed upon the stage amid the clashing of timbrels, beating of gongs, and squeaking of other instruments. He was brandishing a short sword in each hand, now and then wheeling round apparently to protect himself in the rear, and all the time performing the most extraordinary actions with his feet, which seemed as if they had to do as much of the fighting as the hands. People who have seen much of the maneuvering of Chinese troops will not call this unnatural acting. [68]

                          As Fortune noted, such stage fighting was an accurate, if exaggerated, portrayal of actual Chinese fighting techniques. It would be a mistake, however, to dismiss this theatrical tradition as a mere imitation of the real martial arts. Image and reality have reflected each other for millennia, and real martial artists have often found the most practical use for their skills in earning a living as entertainers.
                          In late imperial times Boxers toured the countryside, fighting in competitions at market fairs as a way of life. An eighteenth-century satirical novel, The Scholars, provides an excellent description of a typical knight-errant (ywhsia) hero who is "seen at his best in a sword dance," and who turns out to be something of a fraud. Today, in Beijing, martial arts experts can still be found performing breathing exercises and splitting bricks with their heads in sideshows at amusement parks. [69] If the actual moves of the martial arts are enmeshed in the theatrical tradition, the image of the martial arts hero comes from another source altogether. This is the knight-errant, champion of the down-trodden, who roams the land righting injustice with his practiced sword arm. [70]

                          This heroic figure has an actual historical foundation in the classical philosophical school of Mo Tzu (fifth century B.C.), who opposed offensive warfare and trained his band of followers to go to the aid of states that were being attacked. For centuries after the time of Mo Tzu such men must have existed, since the historian Ssu-ma Ch'ien (c. 145-90 B.C.) included biographies of knights-errant in his monumental work. [71]

                          Before the T'ang dynasty (617-907) the Chinese literary tradition made no clear distinction between the modern categories of fiction and non-fiction, although elements of what we would call fiction were present. Some of China's earliest attempts at fiction are simply fantastic stories presented in the guise of fact, and the traditional Chinese novel never really shed its historical coloration. The famous Water Margin (Shui-hu chuan), for example, which so profoundly influenced the young Mao Tse-tung, has been described by an eminent Chinese scholar as "a conscious fabrication of pseudo history." [72]

                          In accounts of Chinese combat, therefore, exaggeration "in the direction of fantasy" should alert one to the presence of a fictional narrative mode. [73] An excellent early example is the following episode from a first-century text, the Wa-Yueh ch'un-ch'iu. In this story, the king of Yueh is instructed in the arts of swords and halberds by a virgin of the "Southern Groves" (Chekiang). She tells him of an encounter with an old man who turned into a white ape when defeated in combat, and, with a heavy dose of Taoist concepts, says: "The Way of hand combat is to realize your spirit within, yet appear calm externally. Look at her and she seems to be a pleasing lady, but snatch at her and she is like a fearsome tiger." The instruction impressed the king, and he subsequently had his troops learn her arts. [74]

                          Tales of fabulous swordsmen became popular in China around the ninth century. A thousand years later, at the end of the nineteenth century, stories of knights-errant became the chief format for Chinese adventure fiction, and they remain popular today in television and movies. [75] According to one explanation, the popularity of this genre of fiction in modern times may "reflect the wishful thinking of a weakened nation in the face of foreign powers with superior military strength." [76]

                          In the last imperial dynasty many of these novels emphasized not just knights-errant but the martial arts in particular, and the tales often became filled with technical descriptions of fights, dwelling on the marvelous skills of the martial arts heroes. [77] At about the same time, warrior monks from Shaolin temple became stock characters in novels of this genre, and anti-Manchu secret societies capitalized on this reputation by claiming Shaolin affiliations. The swordsman heroes of these popular entertainments were not only skilled in boxing, fencing and the use of other weapons, but were also invested with fantastic acrobatic abilities that stretch the bounds of credibility. [78]

                          Fiction and reality bounced back and forth off each other like reflections in a hall of mirrors. The author of a seventeenth. century sequel to the renowned Water Margin, for example, based some of his characters on the real-life exploits of folk-hero bandits during the Ming-Ch'ing transition, who in turn had patterned themselves in part after the heroes of the original Water Margin--itself loosely based on history. Fictional characters mirrored actual human beings, and real people then looked to them for role models. [79]

                          //////////////////////////////////////////////////End///////////////////////////////////////////


                          Literary references:

                          63 Reid and Croucher, Fighting Arts, 62, 73-75.

                          64 The division into civil and military entertainments is described in DeWoskin, "On Narrative Revolutions," Chinese Literature: Essays, Articles, Reviews 5 (1983): 29-45, esp. 39-41. The dance can be found in Yu Shih-nan, Pei-t'ang shu-ch'ao (Taipei, 1974), 476. For the Han acrobatics, see W. Eberhard, "Thoughts About Chinese Folk Theatre Performances," Oriens Extremus, no. 1 (1981): 5-7.

                          65 Ku-chin t'u-shu chi-ch'eng, vol. 487, chuan, 810, 6lb. The encyclopedia is described in Ssu-yu Teng and Knight Biggerstaff, eds., An Annotated Bibliography of Selected Chinese Reference Works, 3rd ed. (Cambridge, 1950), 95. See also Giles, Adversaria Sinica, 133; Li Fang, et al., T'ai-p'ing ya-lan, 3483.

                          66 Ku-chin t'u-shu chi'ch'eng, vol. 487, chuan 810, 61b. See also William Dolby, A History of Chinese Drama (New York, 1976), 3; and Matsuda Takatomo, Chung-kuo wu-shu shih-lueh, 265, table.

                          67 James I. Crump, "The Elements of Yuan Opera," Journal of Asian Studies 17 (May 1958): 417-34, esp. 421, 433; James J. Y. Liu, The Chinese Knight-Errant (Chicago, 1967), 191.

                          68 Robert Fortune, A Residence Among the Chinese: Inland, On the Coast, and at Sea (1857; reprint, Taipei, 1971), 258.

                          69 Wu Ching-tzu, The Scholars, trans. Yang Hsien-yi and Gladys Yang (Beijing, 1973), 139-40 and 142-45. See also Naquin, Millenarian Rebellion, 32; Purcell, Boxer Uprising, 162; and Fred C. Shapiro, "Letter From Beijing," The New Yorker, 28 December 1987, 96.

                          70 Liu, Chinese Knight.Errant, xii; Robert Ruhlmann, "Traditional Heroes in Chinese Popular Fiction," in Confucianism and Chinese Civilization, ed. Arthur F. Wright (Stanford, 1959), 152.

                          71 See Milton M. Chiu, The Tao of Chinese Religion (Lanham, Md., 1984), 330-32; and Liu, Chinese Knight-Errant, I3-17.

                          72 C. T. Hsia, The Classic Chinese Novel: A Critical Introduction (New York, 1968), 75, For Shui-hu chuan's influence on the young Mao, see Edgar Snow, Red Star Over China, rev. ed. (New York, 1968), 133.

                          73 Hsia, "The Military Romance: A Genre of Chinese Fiction," in Studies in Chinese Literary Genres, ed. Cyril Birch (Berkeley, 1974), 345 and note 10.

                          74 Chao Yeh, ed., Wu-Yueh ch'un-ch'iu(Taipei, 1980), 9.6a-6b. For an analysis of this text, see David Johnson, "The Wu Tzu-hsu Pien.wen and Its Sources: Part I," Harvard Journal of Asiatic Studies 40 (June 1980): 83-156, esp. 151.

                          75 Liu, Chinese Knight-Errant, 81; Hsia, Classic Chinese Novel, 331 notes 48 and 49; Hsia, "Military Romance," 384.

                          76 Liu, Chinese Knight-Errant, 135. See also J. Ch'en, "Nature and Characteristics," 291.

                          77 Liu, Chinese Knight-Errant, 117, 134-35; Ruhlmann, "Traditional Heroes," 148. For an example in an eighteenth-century detective novel, see Van Gulik, Celebrated Cases, 104-105.

                          78 Matsuda Takatomo, Chung-kuo wu-shu shih-lueh, 60, 63. The secret brotherhood of the Triads, for example, claimed to have been founded by Shaolin monks of Fukien in 1674, according to Eastman, Family, Fields, and Ancestors, 222. See also Ruhlmann, "Traditional Heroes," 147. An extreme example of fantastic powers in the martial arts can be found in Wu Ch'eng-en's sixteenth-century novel, Hsi-yu chi, translated by Arthur Waley as Monkey (New York, 1943), passim, but esp. 29-30.

                          79 Ellen Widmer, The Margins of Utopia: Shut-ha hou-chuan and the Literature of Ming Loyalism (Cambridge, 1987), 60-61.

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                          • #14
                            I understand what you're saying, but isn't this kind of a stretch? In a hundred years, if one looks back at WWF wrestling nonsense, people could make the same association with the supposed combat arts of the day. And yet, what you find in the wrestling ring has absolutely nothing to do with what is taught to our military special forces units.
                            Experienced Community organizer. Yeah, let's choose him to run the free world. It will be historic. What could possibly go wrong...

                            "You're just a jaded cynical mother****er...." Jeffpeg

                            (more comments in my User Profile)
                            russbo.com


                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by doc
                              I understand what you're saying, but isn't this kind of a stretch? In a hundred years, if one looks back at WWF wrestling nonsense, people could make the same association with the supposed combat arts of the day. And yet, what you find in the wrestling ring has absolutely nothing to do with what is taught to our military special forces units.

                              Doc,

                              I agree that is is a stretch, but I thought it worthwhile to give people something to think.


                              Uwe

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