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  • Biological basis for race

    Dr. Richard Russell,
    my name is xxxxx xxxx. My co-worker, (Maestro) (who gave me this email address after we had a discussion about race) said you are a proponent of the the biological basis of race. If it is not inconvenient for you, I would be interested to hear your stance on this question. Racial issues are something that interest me and I would like to learn as much as I can.

    Thank you

    Sincerely,
    xxxx xxx
    Is there another basis for race? Have I missed something here?

    What are they teaching in schools these days...
    Experienced Community organizer. Yeah, let's choose him to run the free world. It will be historic. What could possibly go wrong...

    "You're just a jaded cynical mother****er...." Jeffpeg

    (more comments in my User Profile)
    russbo.com



  • #2
    If there was not a biological component it would be possible for 2 white parents to give birth to an asian or black baby. Or the other way around.

    I think by biological maybe he meant there is an obvious genetic firrence that can be seen in someones DNA. like you can get a DNA sample and tell if its black, white, hispanic or whatever. Or maybe not maybe he's just a weirdo asking weird questions.
    The essential point in science it not a complicated mathematical formalism or a ritualized experimentation. Rather the heart of science is a kind of shrewd honesty the springs from really wanting to know what the hell is going on!

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    • #3
      Let's ask this to Happeh. He probably has an explanation, for example, that the DNA has the shape of the half taiji and this explains how the race is defined genetically.
      No Chumbas, por favor!

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      • #4
        I got a response, and it was, surprisingly, what I had expected.

        Yes, I've been taught (by a teacher who majored in cultural anthropology) that racial divisions are essentially arbitrary cultural creations. His argument concedes that race exists, but only on a cultural level-- not a biological or genetic level.
        They're teaching this in college now?
        Experienced Community organizer. Yeah, let's choose him to run the free world. It will be historic. What could possibly go wrong...

        "You're just a jaded cynical mother****er...." Jeffpeg

        (more comments in my User Profile)
        russbo.com


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        • #5
          humans adapt differently to different regions and stimuli, a "race" as science sees it, is just our species of human what is it? homosapiensapiens adapted to the different regions and climates of the world , biologically and genetically. did i spell those right? dammit i need to go back to school...

          a culture is a product of the human mind.

          yep, most of the stuff they teach in school nowadays is just pure crap.
          "Life is a run. In attack we run, in defense we run. When you can no longer run, time to die" - Shichiroji "Seven samurai"

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          • #6
            Well, let's think about that.

            If a culture defines beauty a certain way, the mating will reflect those traits deemed "beautiful". For instance, a bigger ass, fuller lips, different skin pigments, different bone structure, etc.

            So there is a correlation, although I don't know if race can be chaulked up to cultural. Certainly if the origin of man was Afro-centric, the darker homosapiens might opt for fattier, more dense bone structures, as well as a lighter skin pigment for camoflauge purposes when it came to going into Europe and what not.

            However, there has to be a degree of adaptation not inherent to culture and conscious mating decisions. For instance, peoples in high altitude climates have developed more efficient respiratory systems in relation to the effects of high altitudes. This is a biological difference that seperates, say, Peruvian native americans to valley-dwellers.
            Becoming what I've dreamed about.

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            • #7
              I got another response from this woman, one which is more enlightening than the first:

              His is the only argument I've heard. That's why I'm asking you for your opinion. My question is, is there genetic evidence for race? does race go beyond appearance?

              My professor made the point that people who's ancestors have lived in a particular region for a long time will have similar appearances; however, the fact that certain people look alike doesn't prove that "the Asian race" is a biological reality.

              where does the Asian race end and another race begin? who decides which characteristics define the Asian race? haven't racial definitions changed over time? couldn't racial categories be broken down into larger or smaller groups? if someone were to walk in a line across Europe into Asia, would there be a place where people suddenly became more "Asian"- looking, or would it be a gradual, imperceptible change? isn't appearance controlled by only a small percent of genes?
              are differences in appearance enough to classify people into different genetic races?


              "His is the only argument I've heard". Interesting that they don't seem to emphasize the genetic basis for race these days in school. How else can anyone explain the transmission of racial traits from parent to child if genetics has nothing to do with it? Cultural characteristics are one thing, granted, stuff like that can be learned, but physical features are physical features.
              Experienced Community organizer. Yeah, let's choose him to run the free world. It will be historic. What could possibly go wrong...

              "You're just a jaded cynical mother****er...." Jeffpeg

              (more comments in my User Profile)
              russbo.com


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              • #8
                Although, it does appear that physical features and characteristics do tend to alter slightly based on the environment one is in.
                "For some reason I'm in a good mood today. I haven't left the house yet, though. "

                "fa hui, you make buddhism sexy." -Zachsan

                "Friends don't let friends do Taekwondo." -Nancy Reagan

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                • #9
                  I don't get it. I'm trying to think of something meaningful to say here but I just don't get it. Of course society decides who belongs to what race. It decides by looking at them and seeing, for instance, whether they're Asian or not. Or if it's not obvious, it decides by looking at the person's family and ancestry. Of course the distinctions have changed over time. What's the point?

                  The differences between people can be muddy and always changing, but that doesn't make them any less real, which is what this girl's teacher seems to be trying tell her. People's capacity for self-deception never ceases to amaze.

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                  • #10
                    So, would eskimos be asian or native american? I understand that traits get passed, thats clear as day, but the classifications of race are what I find interesting, how many, what should be included, etc.....
                    practice wu de

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                    • #11
                      Once you go down that road we are all africans. The first humans came from africa after all. So, if origins define race to some degree then we are all africans.
                      The essential point in science it not a complicated mathematical formalism or a ritualized experimentation. Rather the heart of science is a kind of shrewd honesty the springs from really wanting to know what the hell is going on!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Eskimos are Eskimos. They probably started out as Asians though; but the sort of Asians that we would never call Chinese, Japanese or any of those, because such distinctions hadn't been around yet when they got to North America. Our classifications for race are based on the socieities they originated from, and since societies are manmade, then of course there's no Eskimo "gene" or Chinese "gene". There are a collection of genes that result in certain innate characteristics, which combine with cultural characteristics to constitute the concept of race.

                        As far as how many distinct races we should decide exist or what criteria we should and shouldn't include in the assessment, it's really a moot point, because the human mind and by extension society makes these distinctions spontaneously based on what it observes, and not based on what it's supposed to observe.

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                        • #13
                          Zach... exactly where I was hoping that would go....
                          practice wu de

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                          • #14
                            As an Anthropolgist, Ph. D., Genetics are the only marker for physical racial make up, and that is how I teach it.

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                            • #15
                              I think environment has a huge impact on races which is a result of the human body adaptiing to climate/diet. Culture has an effect also since different people find different attributes attractive.
                              These differences are very superficial; beneath the surface, we are all the same.

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