question about li peng's classes

[zachsan]

hey whaddya know, emre disagrees with me.

but really he doesn't. this, emre, is a perfect example of what i would consider "fighting". sure you were defending yourself. but let's say you fail to adequately defend yourself. you're not going to be dead or in the hospital for 6 months. similar situations are most barfights and trading blows with your buddy because you ****ed the girl he liked. it's just good old-fashioned fisticuffs, nothing to pee your pants about.

for all that, martial arts are great. save yourself a black eye or a chipped tooth while looking cool as hell in the process. if you're willing to pay 90 bucks a month for that, then more power to ya.

the difference should be obvious. if you would look stupid for running away (like with the guy in the car accident), it's probably fighting. if you would look stupid for staying, it's probably bona fide self defense.

[Lipster]

"The guy came out of his car and so did I, to see what the damage was. Only, suddenly he decided he would punch me. "

This is not too clear Emre. You both got out, both chillin, exchanged words, looked at the damage and suddenly he launched himself at you? Or you both got out and he charged at you all pissed off? Or you both got out all pissed off, had a little argument which consequently led to him decide to hit you?

Just to clarify.

[snocap]

Uhh thanks for taking over my thread

Let the guy have your wallet its not worth fighting for and might get you injured trying.If he looks like he's gonna kill you or at least has some kind of indication that he is (perferably taking off whatever he has over his head and shoot you)then fight for your life.You guys make it seem like a movie and how the odds are always on your side.And trust me with out any martial arts you would have no clue of how to handle a life treatening situation like that.We all know since most of us been in a situation such as a fight.Time to face reality guys no more bs.

[emre]

Originally posted by Lipster
"The guy came out of his car and so did I, to see what the damage was. Only, suddenly he decided he would punch me. "

This is not too clear Emre. You both got out, both chillin, exchanged words, looked at the damage and suddenly he launched himself at you? Or you both got out and he charged at you all pissed off? Or you both got out all pissed off, had a little argument which consequently led to him decide to hit you?

Just to clarify.

We both got out. We walked to look at what the damage was. He attacked before any words were exchanged. Like I said, he looked like he was already pissed off/frustrated by the traffic and that's what caused the crash in the first place.

Zach, I don't disagree with you on purpose, I swear



The problem is, the line between when it's serious and when it's just a minor scrap is not always clear or predictable. A minor scrap can always escalate into something much more serious if someone loses it.

The reason I told this story however, was to counter this specific argument that I see all too often: "I don't learn/practice applications or sparring, but you shouldn't use your Gongfu to defend yourself anyway because you're stupid if you think you can fight 4 gang members with knives all by yourself in a dark alley".

So I made the point that you may not always be fighting for your life, but you still wouldn't want to get punched in the face. The thing is, you still need to have trained applications and sparring, even to succeed in a minor scrap like the one I described.

[snocap]

Better then nothing right

[meattosser]

I definitely agree with Emre on this one. But dammit, let's get back to the FOCUS of this thread. From what I understood, Snocap wanted details on what LiPeng's classes were like. (I know, I know, I just jumped onto this thread from outta nowhere, hahaha.)

[mortal]

Alright here it goes.

1) The class starts with running around in a big circle for a while. Then you run backward, sidewards, backwards and sprints.
2) break off on your own and stretch out for 5 minutes.
3) line up and do 10 of every kick with each leg in a row without resting.
4) form a line and take turns doing shaolin basics across the room.
5) still in line take turns doing jumps and jumping kicks across the room.
6) Break off into seperate groups and practice forms based on what your up to.

There you have it. No sparring for anyone.

He has students who have been at the school for many years. They do not spar. Ever.

Yan mings and Hengxins are strikingly similar. I think it is huge coincidance none of these talented guys teach acual kungfu fighting application.

The applications from the forms are pathetic and not realistic. If anyone know the apps and wants to show me why and how they are practical in combat. Contact me. I really would love to be shown the real thing.

All this about not being ready for sparring is an excuse. if you are paying money to learn they have to teach. We aren't in china anymore. So the ass kissing and favoritism should be out the door.

[zachsan]

Originally posted by emre
The problem is, the line between when it's serious and when it's just a minor scrap is not always clear or predictable. A minor scrap can always escalate into something much more serious if someone loses it.

i agree 100%. all i'm saying is, when it does, run away.

if it's a harmless fight, by all means, stay, use your gongfu, show off, just make sure you don't really hurt anyone. if it gets serious, do not stay, do not use your gongfu, but run. if it always was serious (guys with knives), do not stay, do not use your gongfu, but run.

in one of these serious situations, if you need to execute some killer technique to get out of a hold - SO THAT YOU CAN RUN - by all means, do so, and thank your gongfu training. just do not try to stay and fight.

that's just common sense, guys. it shouldn't really need to be said, but given the "superman" mentality that's so common in MA today, it does.

[mortal]

Zachsan

Why shouldn't you stay and fight? I've seen guys duke it out many times. I think it could be healthy. I don't think you should never stick up for your self. I mean this whith the utmost respect but that makes you sound like a pussy. If someone causes you to start swinging in self defense you want to knock them out. Quickly if possible. I'm not going to run the second I back some one up. i'm going to finish the job and make him run if he still can. I think most people would agree.

I saw a guy take out nunchucks once on this kid. The kids friend grabbed the chucks out of his hand from behind and they both beat the guy down. In your opinion the kids should have ran when he pulled out the chucks correct?

[doc]

I understand your point Mortal, but, there are other factors that get involved in these things.

Horrible, devastating, expensive things.

Like lawyers. And civil and criminal litigation.

Once you've been involved, you never, ever want to see it again. Trust me.

[zachsan]

mortal, i can only say the same thing so many times. there are times when it's appropriate to stick up for yourself. there are times when it is not.

honestly man, you pretty much proved my point. those kids didn't stick up for themselves. they beat the crap out of some poor bastard who thought he was a superman. if he was carrying nunchucks around on the street, and thought they would let him push everyone around, chances are he was some mcdojo student with his head in the clouds. hopefully he didn't have to stay in the hospital too long to learn his lesson. if you think that makes those kids brave, fine. they're very fortunate if the cops didn't get to them.

[mortal]

Of course it makes them brave.

Tuff as well.

I guess what I'm saying is sticking up for yourself doesn't always increase the chances of you being injured. It could sometimes minimize them.

Stop being so paraniod about being arrested. You know how many fights I've seen without someone being arrested?

[emre]

Zach, you're not going to believe this but I agree.

Sometimes , you just have to swallow your pride. It's better than getting hurt or getting sued.

You just should be able to at least put up a fight if you have to, if you're practicing a martial art. The only advantage you get from years of training shouldn't be superior body conditioning, that's all I'm saying.

[mortal]

agreed. If you want to get in shape try an aerobics class. That is what you are reducing martial arts training to.

Swallowing your pride is what wimps do when they are afraid to stick up for themselves. Where I come from you would get abused for life from the poeple you backed down to.

I guess it all depends on the situation.

[zachsan]

well mortal, you are obviously a lover of absolutes, but even you said it: "it depends on the situation."

yes. for the love of god, yes.

now i'm going to stop before my girlfriend is forced to commit me to the looney bin.

i leave you with this article and metaphorically run home crying.