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What martial art is most practical in a fight?

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  • #31
    Originally posted by zachsan View Post
    it's very productive in the sense that it makes him look cool (to certain individuals) and thus makes him money. Also, it was pretty funny watching that big guy flail backwards for no reason.
    ha ha ha, oh, i see it now!!!

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    • #32
      Originally posted by Fu Jow Pai View Post
      i would not be prepared to smash someone in the face with a piece of metal, nor would i shoot someone. But if someone wants to do that or wants to go that far, then they WILL win.
      Are you talking about two guys who have similar training or have no training both. Or maybe sombody who has never trained anything in his life put wants to kill you and a highly skilled martial artist as a opponent? who maybe does not want either of them injured?

      I cant see how the none training dude could win the martial artist. Because hes trained, he does not need to be the first to kill, he controls the fight and the outcome, he never lets the situation rise to the level of dying or living.

      But with two equals, that anonther story.

      Am i misunderstanding anything here?

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      • #33
        if u give a psycho a knife i dont care if he doesnt have training if you dont got a knife hes probably gonna hurt you seriously.

        there are to many variables for such questions, there are no regular people, and a "normal" unskilled person can be just as dangerous as anyone else.
        "did you ask me to consider dick with you??" blooming tianshi lotus

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Maestro View Post
          if u give a psycho a knife i dont care if he doesnt have training if you dont got a knife hes probably gonna hurt you seriously.

          there are to many variables for such questions, there are no regular people, and a "normal" unskilled person can be just as dangerous as anyone else.

          Ya ok i get the point. But could be misleading

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          • #35
            Guns and knives

            I received an email about this thread and someone was commenting about attacks from adversary weilding gun or knife. I will paraphrase Bruce Tegner who developed the hand to hand combat course for U.S. Treasury agents. " When confronted by an adversary, threatening you with a gun or knife; You have a moral obligation to provide behavior modification therapy, you must hurt them."

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            • #36
              Originally posted by SiFu Peterson View Post
              When confronted by an adversary, threatening you with a gun or knife; You have a moral obligation to provide behavior modification therapy, you must hurt them."
              ****ING A!

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              • #37
                In recent years I've found that styles that emphasize sparring and not forms tend to develop combat effectiveness MUCH faster.

                Namely boxing, Muay Thai, and brazilian jiu jitsu.

                I love internal arts but have never met a strictly internal martial artist who could deal with a trained exponent of combat sports. Rush while jabbing, clinch, throw, pass the guard on the throw, slide into mount and then elbow until they admit that Tai Ji is great for health but is quite poor when it comes to preparing someone for a fight.

                And this is coming from someone who utilizes my Tai Ji Quan in my jiu jitsu game.
                Show me a man who has forgotten words, so that I can have a word with him.

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                • #38
                  that is because the utility of systems like taijiquan is not the material conquest of an opponent, but the pursuit of enlightenment through an understanding of conflict. Taiji would fail itself as a daoist notion by creating the spiritual imbalance that is produced by "always winning". To use a system like taijiquan for the preservation of the body requires (and produces) a completely different state of being than a system like the ones listed.

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                  • #39
                    I think it depends what "combat" your referring to, in the end something is better then nothing and training for any type of combat is different then just training any style, not matter muay thai or tai chi
                    "did you ask me to consider dick with you??" blooming tianshi lotus

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by dogchow108 View Post
                      that is because the utility of systems like taijiquan is not the material conquest of an opponent, but the pursuit of enlightenment through an understanding of conflict. Taiji would fail itself as a daoist notion by creating the spiritual imbalance that is produced by "always winning". To use a system like taijiquan for the preservation of the body requires (and produces) a completely different state of being than a system like the ones listed.
                      Well certainly. You get what you train, and I'll be the first to say I train both internal arts and arts centered around sparring a live opponent, but the original question did say in a fight.

                      Competing for the sake of strengthening and cultivating oneself is not by default spiritually imbalancing.

                      The competition itself is not inherently undaoist. One can do well in sports through a physical understanding of the dao. There is art in boxing, just as there is in cooking, archery, or taijiquan. At the same time if the question is one of fighting effectiveness, training against a live resisting opponent is essential. Without this, understanding of how to fight is hollow.

                      There is an old story that the master who focused only on the internal was eaten by a tiger. And he who trained only the external, devoured by cancer.

                      Train both. Let each empower the other.
                      Last edited by daodejing; 12-11-2012, 04:24 AM.
                      Show me a man who has forgotten words, so that I can have a word with him.

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                      • #41
                        you missed the point (or failed to address it), but the one you made is still relevant and consistent. Interestingly, you noted competition and sports, which i agree are two things which can prove immensely useful in understanding the bigger picture. competition is, after all a historically viable expression of perpetuation.

                        You are right, however, to point out the original context of the question. what i meant is that a "fighter" seeks to physically conquer his opponent and aims never to lose. the fact that many "martial art" studios teach this mentality is why i abandoned them altogether- they are not what they claim to be. someone truly practicing a Daoist art will understand that what people are seeing as a "fight" is an instance which involves destruction and creation, and work in harmony with the nature of Dao to bring about balance. there is no "win" or "lose" in such a moment of conflict, there is simply Dao. Who comes out more battered is a trivial matter.

                        Loved the story of the tiger and cancer.

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                        • #42
                          Don't get me wrong i don't think it has a ton to do with the style, more the training. Without live resistance in training one will lack timing in offense and defense. It's possible for someone to start a xingyi or taiji school that has alot of live sparring (at intermediate levels and above, not for beginners) or live grappling (qin na at least) and develop fighting effectiveness.

                          Similarly someone who trains jiu jitsu from a forms perspective while never freetraining against a resisting opponent will have hollow technique.

                          If you practice martial art solely as a moving meditation forms and qigong are sufficient. But if you want to be able to defend yourself against an unarmed assailant or your work requires you to safely subdue people (security, law enforcement, military) there is no substitute for live training against a fully resisting opponent. It doesn't have to be an obsession with winning. It can be a knowledge that you will win and lose in training but will persevere in life and grow stronger.

                          The thing is to get good at anything you need to practice it. Things that are more practical in live fights are arts that are applied practically in live training repeatedly and adding towards work over time aka gong fu.


                          Is it possible for competition to spiritually derange a person? Yes, but the same could also be said of sex, or parenthood. And yet all three things can also strengthen one's spirit if cultivated properly.
                          Last edited by daodejing; 12-11-2012, 02:56 PM.
                          Show me a man who has forgotten words, so that I can have a word with him.

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                          • #43
                            There is an old story that the master who focused only on the internal was eaten by a tiger. And he who trained only the external, devoured by cancer.
                            Is the implication that mastery of internal martial arts will allow you to prevent cancer and mastery of the external can help you defeat a tiger?
                            Last edited by J-schum; 12-11-2012, 05:26 PM. Reason: grammer

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                            • #44
                              I have a feeling this old story isn't very old since the Chinese didn't know shit about cancer until recently.

                              Also internal and external are arbitrary terms and have no bearing as far as real practice is concerned.
                              "did you ask me to consider dick with you??" blooming tianshi lotus

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                              • #45
                                Good thing we westerners jumped right in and taught them how to cure it, right?

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