Women Training with Men (and Teen Boys)

[onesp1ng]

vulnerable...and focused.

although i do get doc's point. it happened this past year i think with me, with one of my professors, though that seemed to be more about power than anything. more specifically, face, perhaps.

and, now to think of it, i have been smitten with one or two female training partners in the past. (not the teacher and student previously mentioned.)
but, i think it was good all around.. take each situation for what it is. at times it may have been distracting, maybe, but at other times it was rather encouraging. some good clean motivation, i think. seems very healthy to me.

wait a sec....can it be that doc actually agreed with mbokohutu, and myself, bl..??? for once?

amazing.......

...

[doc]

No.

There's a difference between "being smitten" and having a sort of attraction. The dynamics between the sexes can be a complex one, and even though there may not be any desire, there still can be other factors that interfere, such as power, ego, domination, face, etc. Men will act differently when in front of women, than when they're solely with the boys, for example. The same goes with women.

[nuxia]

too many questions...

I think that 's why we either subconciously or forefrontally start to query ourselves on the appropriateness of our interactions and on terms of what consitutes an alpha and of each gender and also make assessments based on those things of what an ideal partner might or might not be for us.

DO YOU THINK THERE ARE AS MANY ALPHA FEMALES AS ALPHA MALES?



Just recently, less than a monthy perhaps, I has the pleasure of when ShiDiYang came to town for a cpl of weeks, nOt meeting with him.
I did actually have a tentative date for a meal and chat in lieu of the seminar appearance I diidn't want to do for exactly along the lines of the above and that I 'm probably generally more private when it comes to my training mind with and under certain ppl, butt, because his chaperone was concerened that I was female and was apparently looking at the appropriateness of that, I decided that it would probably be more productive for me not to meet with him at this time.
Just like with alot of the other monks I would love to chat or study kungfu with, to be most honest, I'm really not sure of how to put together a kosher intimate space between us where I would have saught that out. Sooo, that said , until circumstances are different enough for that to make a difference should it ever be going to, I'm quite happy to just trust myself and what i know about how to put together my own condition and regime and continue to do what else i have to do elsewhere.

THIS IS MY ISSUE EXACTLY. DOES IT MEAN ONE IS "NOT READY" or "DESERVES WHAT THEY GET"? OF COURSE WE CAN CULTIVATE ON OUR OWN, BUT DOESN'T CHAN TEACH AN IMPORTANT ROLE IN MASTER/STUDENT TRANSMISSION IN CULTIVATION? IT SEEMS UNFAIR FOR A FEMALE TO MISS THIS OPPORTUNITY. AND SAFETY IS PARTICULARLY IMPORTANT IN THIS AREA, WHERE ONE IS VASTLY MORE POWERFUL THAN ANOTHER. AND THESE MASTERS DON'T EXACTLY GROW ON TREES, ALTHOUGH THEY ARE EASY TO SPOT ONCE ENCOUNTERED. IF ONLY MORE WOMEN AND GIRLS COULD BE FREED TO FOLLOW THIS PATH AND TEACH OTHERS.

owned by sex, owned by money, owned by food and survival needs, owned by our primal natures to reproduce, and owned by the fact of appropriate means to put it out there.. liike the shows shaolin has been doing and by the fact of the need to spread the word.

ppl are soo desperate that it's no surprise that they have trouble understanding the difference between appropriate and otherwise. .. and in fact... I'm prettty darned sure that that is the entire point.

DESPERATE CURIOSITY.

Thanks for the media .).

amitabha.

Blooming tianshi lotus.

[doc]

I don't think you would have had any troubles with Deyang. Now, some of the other guys, I wouldn't say the same thing about.... There have been "relationships" between some of these guys and female students, my "monk" being an example, Yanming and oh so many others, also.

You have to remember something. I see this over and over again. Most of these guys in orange robes know little about Buddhism and its tenets; they don't even know what a monk is or what a monk is supposed to do. People need their heroes, and for some, elevating some Chinese peasant who trained at the wushu guan for a while and who wears orange clothing with great gong fu skills, to some semi-deity, is common. I don't blame them; I blame the individuals who need these "heroes".

They are men. And, in some instances, children. They have needs and desires, and because of their lack of education compared to the western world, might not have the sense of responsibility that one accrues living in western society.

Stop making gods out of these people. And that goes for your karate "master" down the block in his McDojo. See them for what they truly are. And then, interact with them understanding that.

[onefocus]

I agree that it is a slippery slope when it concerns the sexes training together.

but I believe i said that it doesn't matter if the players are DEDICATED to the training they are working to get under their belts.

it has been advised, that one should not train spouses or family, for similar reasons.

no one can stop the romantic dynamic that happens, but honest consideration of why you train in martial arts should keep you focused on training.

after all, there is a place for romance, just not in school.


peace

onefocus

[doc]

I understand what you're saying OF, but, my point was, regardless of the dedication etc, there is always going to be that dynamic between the sexes occuring, to SOME degree. Granted, it might not be obvious or imposing, but, it is still there, and it still plays a role in the interaction that takes place.

[nuxia]

They are men. And, in some instances, children. They have needs and desires, and because of their lack of education compared to the western world, might not have the sense of responsibility that one accrues living in western society.

ALWAYS GOOD TO KEEP IN MIND.


__________________
"You're just a jaded cynical mother****er...." Jeffpeg

SAYS THE REST!

[blooming tianshi lotus]

DO YOU THINK THERE ARE AS MANY ALPHA FEMALES AS ALPHA MALES?


.

the concept of yin and yang would dictate so, yes.


i looked at that post of yours Onesp1ng. . and I wondered what the term shije means elative to "smitten" / " attraction" and kungfu.

nm. .

What gongli *shrug*.

[doc]

Just curious, how do you define an "alpha female"?

The one's I've known wore leather, had tatoos, and generally had girlfriends.

[master-lu]

training with women there is nothing better!!!!!

oooh yeeah this is my kind of topic! As a male, i love to train with women. seeing the girls do sertain exercises does really affect me. I would not call it a distraction rather it makes me fight even harder! It gets my testosteron up and i work at my maximum ability. Today I train mostly by myself and sometimes with others but they are only male. I remember the good old days a couple of years ago when i trained in a club with girls- several of them good looking. I look back upon those times with a smile! I loved it- i love girls! I'm not ashamed of it, i look at them and i fantasize and i enjoy it greatly. You are deffintetly right about those things you mentioned like watching a girl doing splits etc.. It really makes our hearts pound! Any guys who deny this are lying or they're ashamed and to boyish to admit it. I am a man and women turn me on like hell!!! I remember when one of the girls wanted a strong partner to train with and we trained together for a whole session. I think I had a hard on, parden the expression but it's the honest truth, the whole time- and she knew it. When doing stretch excercises together she held my hands and squeezed them as the pain made her moan- at least that's they way it sounded to me. Damn she was killing me! her touching me moaning etc made me so damn horny i thought i would explode. Girls can easily wrap us guys around their fingers. Bring out the best and the worst in us. Damn i miss training with girls, watching them sweat, streatch their legs and buttocks, hold their t shirts in place, moan from exhaustion etc... I love to teas them about being girls and weak and then have them try to wrestle me to the ground using their hot sweaty bodies, grabbing me everywhere etc.. I used to give up and fall sometimes just to have them lay on top of me pinning me to the floor- MY GOD!!!!!!! If there's anything esle you would like to know about the male perspective please do not hesitate.

[doc]

seeing the girls do sertain exercises does really affect me. I would not call it a distraction rather it makes me fight even harder! It gets my testosteron up and i work at my maximum ability.

In a way, this could be summarized as a "mating behavior" or courtship exhibition.

As I've said before, sometimes its difficult to interact with women and not have these behaviors manifest themselves.

[master-lu]

Hey doc you are right! courtship exhibition it is.
As I've said before, sometimes its difficult to interact with women and not have these behaviors manifest themselves

Hey I think that it's damn near impossible to interact with women and not have these behaviours manifest themselves. Further more i enjoy it- it's cute, it's fun, it's human nature! It's not a bad thing it's beautiful! Embrace it!
We are not robots and nore should we strive to be.

[doc]

Agree. But when training with women, these things need to be understood. They appear. They happen. They can cause "issues". And in this day and age, with the ever enlarging and changing concept of "sexual harassment", and pursuit thereof, (especially here in the US), it has to be constantly thought of.

[blooming tianshi lotus]

In a way, this could be summarized as a "mating behavior" or courtship exhibition.

As I've said before, sometimes its difficult to interact with women and not have these behaviors manifest themselves.

maybe it's just about maturity in general.

I'm flattered you think I can answer your question though.
An alpha is only an alpha in contrast to the rest. Considering the terms for that as far as the role that plays in maintaining the species , and feel free to meditate on that, and even how that relates to the way buddha looks after our natural hormone production and release levels with things like right focus and right placement of affections as far as terms for terms relationships and sex with whom goes, and then parenting issues , as described in so many other doctrine, I reeally fail to see where gay ppl are alphas at all, despite that I can see an otherwise clearcut strong case for a person thinking so.
In terms of scientology, if that was the ideal state, then we would extinguish ourselves as a species, and thaat would make that a war planet. totally owwwned btw, by the planet where ppl actually pull it off.
I'm fairly sure we've already spelled it all here about that before though.


If it is courting behaviour, to carry on like Master Lu was desrcibing, that's all well and good and it does start out that way with a testosterone surge as one tries to assert dominian, which is initially all good fun, but as we grow older and come into a better understanding of what constitutes the pecking order for which reasons, whether we openly admit or talk about those things or not, which is what enlightenment is imo designed to acheive awareness of, science says that a. that generally decreases in release and production and b. that it is directly relative to the way one perceives one's partner or partner potential and where they see them in the same order.

We're not robots. i agree . and thaat's why sex and relationships matter to us and our primal instincts and nature and is something that every one of us has to confront at one stage or other in our lives.

no avoiding it. and that's myy point.

.. kungfu is meant to teach us how to handle and function through all types of ppl, unreasonable or otherwise and develop a mind and stay focussed regardles of the situation. If we dont like it, we can leave.
If that's how ppl have a nature to behave , then at some time or other, we're probably going to meet it anyway.



Blooming tianshi lotus.

[master-lu]

Well i gree with you doc. I forgot to mention that indeed it is a powder keg it can easily explode. This is the downside of training like this. Ever broadening and changing of the concept of sexual harassment is a fact in sweden also. You could easily get your self into a world of shit, basically, for looking at someone the wrong way. The problem is not natural human sexuality but rather human cultural insanity. People often choose to get offended by the smallest things for no particular reason, this behaviour makes them start trouble wear there did not have to be any. But i never had any such problems with the girls at my club so I'm still for training with girls- as long as they're not ugly ofcourse. And I welcome anyone here to call me sexist and throw some feminist bullshit at me. I dont care. I am a man, i love beautiful women and i will never apologise for it.