religious differences?

[Mike Evans]

Not sure if this is the correct forum for this, but here it is anyway:

I keep seeing posts on various threads about people who are against martial arts training/meditation/tcm/and every other thing because they are buddhist/violent/demonic/etc. What are some of the concerns you have come across and how have you handled them. This is interesting to me as n instructor who has to deal with these topics from parents and students daily...

[Paul702]

Spirituality in Martial Arts

The biggest battle for an instructor is to try to get people to see the religious similarities instead of looking for differences. There's not a religion on earth that doesn't ask its practitioners to meditate, pray, or chant daily. Whether you're Buddhist, Taoist, Christian, Jewish, Native American or what have you, a meditation or chant after a hard day of work/training is instantly rewarding. Deeper down it strengthens whatever spiritual core that student might have. If an instructor's lineage taught Buddhist 'namo' chants, that's fine and it should be made available to the students, BUT, if there are students from other religions, the instructor should ensure that the students know it's okay to substitute. A hail mary, or the Lord's prayer, or other such is perfectly acceptable. Altar imagery can be made to reflect whatever religion the student wishes. Maybe General Guan isn't okay with one student's parents. How about St Michael then? Or maybe the student should talk to his or her religious teacher.

Ultimately, it's all in how the instructor presents it I think. An instructor needs to be well informed and not be shy about the subject, because there are going to be people asking "Is a Buddha the same as Jesus?" and you better be able to answer..heh Adding the spiritual aspect is a big step and a lot of responsibility, but ultimately, it'll elevate your students and you'll feel the reward in your heart.

Just my own opinion, I think it is tragic that so many kung fu schools teach only the physical aspects of the art. Spirituality is as important as any skill or discipline you learn in martial arts.

[zachsan]

i don't think it's tragic. students can, and do, have the option of going to a school based on what they're trying to get out of it.

if i go to KFC, i get fried chicken. if i go to salad works, i get salad. it's not tragic that salad works doesn't sell popcorn chicken. if i want popcorn chicken, i know where to go. if anything's tragic, it's that there is no KFC within walking distance of my apartment.

so, in an ideal world (at least for martial artists), there would be plenty of MA schools in a given area, so the student can find what they are looking for. that seems better to me than a city in which you can't possibly get your MA without a side of religion. and in a perfect world for me, there would also be a KFC near my apartment. maybe i need to move...

[LeiYunFat]

I don't really eat KFC that much...I am more of an In-n-Out kinda guy, but that chain is only in California.

[dogchow108]

This subject has gotten more and more mention in the last few days. Shaolin has obvious religious roots, which can be kept intact or removed when taught to or learned by students. You can treat Buddhism and Shaolin Martial arts as seperate entities, and then you can treat the Kung Fu as a form of Buddhist meditation.
I, personally, bow before doing my forms. I also wear beads on my wrist, which DeCheng gave me for X-mas (imagine that...). I am neither Buddhist nor Christian, but that dosent mean i will discard these things just because of that. I appreciate diversity, and will thus keep intact as much of the meaning in what i have as i can.

But, i think some people tend to get caught up with this. The whole...teenager from Hicksville, America who wants to move to Shaolin to be a monk thing. Its a nice, romantic idea that will leave the dreamer unhappy, cold and hungry. To quote a friend: "scratchin' his balls in DengFeng". I see nothing wrong with teaching Shaolin as a secular system. Honestly, i would prefer learning it that way if the person is not a monk. Either way, regardless of whether the guy is or not, I am not the kind of guy to go and change my religion just so i have an excuse to buzz my hair, sport buddhist beads, chant "omitofo" at every opportunity and wear orange robes. In fact, you'd be amazed: many of the Shaolin monks dont even do it.

Respect diversity, but dont necessarily lose yourself in it. Everything in moderation.

[onesp1ng]

In-and-out kind of guy?

[LeiYunFat]

Yeah, I like the freshness.

[onesp1ng]

Are we talking about the same thing?

[dogchow108]

In-and-out kind of guy?

That's what she said...

Wait, what are we talking about...

[onesp1ng]

Come on, dogchow, get with it. Evryone knows...we're talkin 'bout the freshness.

g

[LeiYunFat]

HAHAHHAHAHA! In-and-Out is a Burger joint...

[dogchow108]

Umm, of course. I knew that...

ok, not really

[onesp1ng]

Dogchow, you knew all along... why doesn't anyone tell me anything? Somehow I thought we were talking about girls.



g

[dogchow108]

I was talking about sexual technique...but Lei Yun Fat had to go and mention food! Now i'm horny and hungry

[Fa Hui]

hahaha, me too. Well... just hungry.

It never ceases to amaze me that when I discussion is going one way, it does a 180 degree turn.

For many of us here, martial arts is not just a hobby, not just a sport, not just something to do after/before work.

It's our path, we want to learn more than just the martial art. We want to learn the culture the language possibly other things like calligraphy or religion. To us martial arts is our path, and evetually everything we do embodies that.

To me martial arts is consist of three arts: Healing, Spiritual, and Martial (fighting). I have loved the martial arts since I first started taking it back in 1994. It was the basis for many things in my life, I became a Buddhist Monk because of the martial arts. Now I met a wonderful girl (who I hope we have a long future together) because of the martial arts. Most of my friends are martial artists, and the people I meet always have an interest in it. It is my life. It is who I am.

Religion is a vessel, martial arts is a vessel, calligraphy, music, anything that is an art is a vessel for spiritual awareness. They create a sense of wholeness and it fullfils the deepest part. You find what you need to keep you going.