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  • #16
    Maestro man you are so wrong its sad.

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    • #17
      Well, in his defense, the applications found within the forms are not meant to caress people, or make friends. Some of them are pretty nasty.
      Experienced Community organizer. Yeah, let's choose him to run the free world. It will be historic. What could possibly go wrong...

      "You're just a jaded cynical mother****er...." Jeffpeg

      (more comments in my User Profile)
      russbo.com


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      • #18
        lolo, dogchow if you didnt disagree with me then i would do some self evaluation, because your always wrong hahaha

        lolo, i seriously dunno what the hell onesp1ng is talking about. dogchow i know doesnt know shit, prolly never even been to china but thats whatever.

        from my exp, chinese people are rude, i dunno if its their culture to be rude and uncooth but they are. their also obssesed with western culture and money lolo but onesp1ng says they all look up to the martial elders for discipline and moral and ethical standards lolo

        which is obviously bullshit. most chinese could give a flying **** about martial arts, hong kong movie business is doing shitty because of the lack of interest. no one really trains in gung fu anymore in china. the chine masters will tell you to your face

        lolo or maybe not the ones you guys train with. theyd also tell you if they were honest that most of the western teachers would whoop ass upon chinese teachers from the mainland, because most of them dont fight and suck

        there are very few who are very good in china, and they are extremely good. as for ethics and shit well i dunno i dont need another father but maybe if mine dies one day i will go seek one out in china...lolo maybe
        "did you ask me to consider dick with you??" blooming tianshi lotus

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        • #19
          you dont know what you are talking about. But then if you did, the world would probably look a lot different.

          You have a lot of heart, and you definately stand up for what you believe is right.

          The only problem is, well, again, how wrong you are. About just about everything.

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          • #20
            Come on!

            I'm very happy to see that i'm not the only one who knows what gong fu is for- it is not for making friends!!!! Sissy new age type people like dogchow are trying to make it in to a sweet gentle dancing type art. They are killing gong fu and making a mockery of the masters of old that they hold in such high esteem. Maestro! You have been rught in everything and it pleases me to find atleast some one on russbo who knows what the hell gong fu is for. I do Xinyi. Every technique in the form is for either braking a limb or slamming the opponent to the ground! Dogchow- you cant deny that!!!!!!! Maestro is right about the chinese too. I have met chinese masters that say the same thing- young people in china are not very interested in gong fu. Gong fu is for fighting etc. What people say is still not very important when it comes down to it- if you learn real gongfu you learn real fighting skill and the meaning of gongfu is very clear. gong fu is no mystery. Many westerners want it to be mysterious, overly spiritual, and friendly. ask yourselves why do you want it to be this way. Many chinese are quick to capitalize on silly romantic westerners. Giving them exactly what they want- "moral guidance" and friendly dance like nonviolent gongfu.
            Gong fu is for killing. Thats it. If you dont like it thats your own problem but thats how it was designed in the old days on the battle fields- back then people defended them selves and their homes from bandits there was no police to take care of them. The old days were very violent and gongfu gave people a chance to handle it. Why is this so hard to grasp for you nonviolent friendsseeking sissy- gongfu practitioner? Please dogchow enlighten us about the sissyness of your gongfu. Do you huge and caress your opponents too?

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            • #21
              i dont think dogchow even practices gung fu let alone is in condition to be fighting anyone. i also doubt that hes ever even been to china lolo.

              hes more akin to talk about politics then gung fu, like most people on this site, as u can tell with the convos.

              this site really has never been a very good source for good martial artists lolo ive come to realise that, because no one really ever talks about martial arts or what really matters in martial arts. more about politics, even the wong kiew kit talks..that was all bullshit lolo, was funny...this definately the best place to go for a laugh

              even though i say gung fu is for killing and all this, really it is. but, the original argument was about teachers and their role. your teacher isnt there to teach u how to behave in society, and a point i made clear early on was most schools have rules anyway lolo, if u dont follow the rules get out, period

              but the teacher isnt there to teach u how to be a good boy and be a source of wisdom and all this bullshit.

              imo, if u go to a teacher, u go to see him to learn his skills because those are the skills u want, if not what are u doing there? to be his friend? to fill a gap in your life? what kind of shit is that, people are just waiting to be taken advantage of i think, a sucker really is born every minute

              and dogchow is a sucker lolo
              "did you ask me to consider dick with you??" blooming tianshi lotus

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              • #22
                Well, Maestro, the shaolin shifus are met were really into buddhism and non violence and love. Isnt it in contradiction with what u say?

                I dont think the abbot of wuwei si or Shi heng jun changed their way to please foreigners.

                So if ur point of view is right when did Shaolin gonfu changed from ur vision of hardcore gongfu to a more spiritual and loving way?

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                • #23
                  liu..i could really give a **** about the modern day wannabe shaolin monks. they cant fight, they dont know shit about buddhism, and they talk shit about everyone

                  anyone with real skills can see the monks for what they are real or fake.

                  now if u want to argue with me about historical facts, then i dont care to get into that.

                  u can argue myths about bak mei and zhan feng etc but they still talk about shaolin monks doing bad deeds which seems to be a reoccuring theme..lolo except to u liu, because your a shaolin nuthugger.

                  now, there are countless storys of the monks fighting, and killing. if u dont know this then go do your own research.

                  if u want to deny the countless rebel sects and schools that came from shaolin like wing chun, choy lei fut, hung ga etc that were known outlaws and fighters etc then thats on u.

                  im not making shit up, i dont care what u think i could really careless, u dont know shit anyway if u gonna argue the infinite ****ing myths and storys of monks and shaolin practitioners fighting and killing and all that
                  "did you ask me to consider dick with you??" blooming tianshi lotus

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                  • #24
                    The shaolin monks operating in shaolin today are actors giving you what you want as long as you are not looking for serious traditional gong fu. Gong fu is for killing I say it again. heng jun etc are actors. and in any case some may be buddhist but that does not give them real gong fu skills. The deadly art of gong fu is for self defense so it doesnt make you evil just from knowing it- relax. Knowing how to kill does not make you a killer- killing makes you a killer. Liu the shaolin monks you mention do not practice gong fu in the old original manner. They do the modern romantic beautiful dance like version and call it traditional. Can you understand this? If you practised real gong fu you would definetly know what i'm talking about.

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                    • #25
                      I m not fighting with u maestro, u apparently seem knowledgable about history. I already said i think u handle a part of the truth.

                      But on the other hand can u deny there are wuseng that are into ethics and buddhism? I dont really understand ur point, r u able to judge them from a superior point of view?

                      And i think gongfu is not only a way to know how to fight in a street fight, but rather to know how to stop the fights. For this it might be good to handle a fight before it happens, and buddhism is about that, establishing conditions where a fight is no use. It is better to put conditions were dialogue and not war happens, instead of just knowing how to fight a war.

                      Master Lu, Shi Heng Jun and the abbot of Wuwei Si seem pretty traditional to me. U use gonfu as synonym of wushu, but in chinese gongfu has a different meaning, it means reaching the perfection, like in gongfu cha, tea gongfu. What do u expect cha gongfu to be? Shi Heng Jun not only teaches Xing Yi but also seated meditation and Fengshui, the Wuwei Si is a buddhist temple. Do u know these people? If not how can you judge without knowing? I think they are examples that prove that wuseng are into ethics. Again what is gong fu skills? U should go back to the meaning of gongfu in chinese, and see it is linked with a way of life that implies perfection of morality.

                      Forget about Shi Heng Jun, head of Fawang Si, and the abbot of Wuwei Si! Mike Tyson is better at gongfu!



                      Om mani pedme hung.
                      Last edited by liutangsanzang; 09-22-2008, 02:54 PM.

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                      • #26
                        U use gonfu as synonym of wushu, but in chinese gongfu has a different meaning, it means reaching the perfection, like in gongfu cha, tea gongfu.
                        I think they are examples that prove that wuseng are into ethics. Again what is gong fu skills? U should go back to the meaning of gongfu in chinese, and see it is linked with a way of life that implies perfection of morality.
                        thank you, liu. i honestly don't feel like debating this topic because these guys already have their mind set in stone.

                        history? real gongfu? these guys know it all. everyone else is living in the land of make believe. gongfu is for killing. period.

                        the problem is, most of their concepts are not even close to those held by people who live here. though, oddly enough, it's these two who presume to know the truth.

                        anyhow, they obviously have very westernized views of the subject. i hope time opens their eyes some....
                        ZhongwenMovies.com

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                        • #27
                          This is one of the most hilarious threads ive seen in quite a while. Apparently it will take you guys some time to see why; but with any luck you will.

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                          • #28
                            this is so old..its not even worth getting upset about lolo. onesp1ng i feel sorry for you, you obviously have issues u need to work on

                            no one is denying that gung fu can mean other things, your play on words is just so annoying i dont want to even remark about it, we are obviously talking about chinese martial arts

                            is chinese martial arts all about killing..lolo no, its not but you guys just like to talk..thats all u do u talk then reroute the subject then talk so more.

                            are chinese martial arts used for health lolo yeah they are, like the chinese guys beijing that do taiji in the park with a cigarrete in their mouth lolo yeah like them

                            im not denying chinese martial arts arent used for health, and spiritual cultivation, ive talked more on these subjects and more indepth about them then anyone here and thats a fact. anyone who wants to challenge my skills and my level can come see me and we will see whos the real deal

                            the point is this. the chinese martial arts right out of the forms are designed for stopping the attacker as quickly as possible, the techniques are made for warfare, u kill or seriously injure somone and u keep on moving on to somone else thats war

                            lack of knowledge and skill in chinese martial arts leads to being like onesp1ng dogchow and liu, none of them have a clue what to do with their gung fu, and they would probably get raped by a 6th grader in a fight

                            i dont know what chinese people onesp1ng are talking about..lolo he must be talking about the taiwanese who dont even consider themselves part of china lolo, or maybe its the illieterate ones who dont even know their own history lolo

                            the fact of the matter is, on the ORIGINAL discussion lolo after the original topic of xing yi, was the role of the master. every real master will tell u, if u cant fight, u have nothing of substance. being able to defend yourself, your family, your animals your crops whatever was #1 in the past, and in present.

                            debate all u like i dont care anymore
                            "did you ask me to consider dick with you??" blooming tianshi lotus

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                            • #29
                              im not denying chinese martial arts arent used for health, and spiritual cultivation, ive talked more on these subjects and more indepth about them then anyone here and thats a fact. anyone who wants to challenge my skills and my level can come see me and we will see whos the real deal
                              sure, it's kill or be killed. we'll fight a duel to the end -- the traditional way -- the real way. i will....no, i must defeat you.

                              ------------------------------------------

                              look, the thing is, the sentiment you continually emphasis is on the wrong side of a deep principle, and it's that which you seem least concerned with. i'm sure you have a very good teacher and you've met some chinese people who were rude, but to say it's only for fighting, to gain skill knowledge, maim and kill, etc., which you've done time and time again, in my opinion is to basically deny everything else that forms the backbone of these arts.

                              the protection of oneself to that of others, honor, balance, health, as well as knowledge and spirit are concepts woven into the asian psyche. we can strip the arts down to bear parts, marginalize them...say they are not "gong fu," per say, but rather for the perfection of killing. yes.

                              but, please, try to never forget the reasons people learn to fight in the first place. don't forget why most don't look forward to it.

                              the goal it preserve life, my friend, not take it.
                              Last edited by onesp1ng; 09-22-2008, 06:25 PM.
                              ZhongwenMovies.com

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                              • #30
                                If u want to have wugong discussion why not continue this one.

                                Again i m not fighting with you Matreya, oops, sorry, Maestro, i think you hold some truth of wushu. Wushu can be rather harsh. But isnt ur part of the truth only a partial one? Please dont think in a western style of opposition but rather in a Yin Yang way of harmonization.

                                Gong fu in chinese is the perfection of an art and it implies some moral perfection. The same ideas are brought with the term Shifu, that not only designates a master in wushu but a gentleman. U can call a taxi driver, shifu.

                                I m not gonna talk about other wushu i dont know, but we can ask what is the goal of shaolin gong fu? It is to end the suffering of every sentient being, including animals and ghosts. So u can be pretty weak at street fighting but good at shaolin gong fu. According to your definition Buddha, Jesus, Gandhi, Thich Nhat Hanh are very weak at gong fu because they hardly know to fight, yet they have done more for world non violence than u will probably will ever do in this life.

                                So for me, wushu gonfu is not being good at fighting but knowing how to establish non violence. I think it also implies some culture, some meditation, some skills about non violent communications, some reflexions about economy, politics, psychology (u can find these topics in the Theravada suttas). Knowing how to fight does not make ur gongfu high.

                                About masters, the shaolin shifus i have known were all in buddhism and meditation and wanted to act like gentlemen (junzi 君子).

                                Now u can meditate on these ideas without being in opposition? We are not fighting here!


                                Om mani pedme hung

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