China Is Growing... BIGGER TITTIES!

[zachsan]

Beauty is subjective my friend. I happen to be of the opinion that a lion chasing down and killing a zebra is one of the more beautiful phenomena in nature. You can disagree with me if you like but any argument that amounts to "your definition of beauty is wrong" is a waste of breath.

[Fa Hui]

Beauty is subjective my friend. I happen to be of the opinion that a lion chasing down and killing a zebra is one of the more beautiful phenomena in nature. You can disagree with me if you like but any argument that amounts to "your definition of beauty is wrong" is a waste of breath.

That is one of the most profound statements I have ever read.

[liutangsanzang]

In Buddhism lions like most animals are seen as very ignorant. For instance they ignore the suffering of other sentient beings.

If we link beauty with compassion, what is the love and compassion of a lion?

Do u think a Lion will help you if u break ur leg?

[Fa Hui]

In Buddhism lions like most animals are seen as very ignorant. For instance they ignore the suffering of other sentient beings.

If we link beauty with compassion, what is the love and compassion of a lion?

Do u think a Lion will help you if u break ur leg?

Liu, once again you totally miss the mark. I'm not sure what it is with you, I really just don't get it. Is it a language problem? Is there some degree of a language barrier that you just completely miss the meaning of the statement?

Can it be something else? Do you just not care to pay attention to what other people write when it doesn't fit your own ideological agenda? I'd liked to know because I don't understand you. I would hope that you would not be so blind and closed off to others perceptions and wisdom to really write the things you do. Are you just truly ignorant?

Could it be that your just not very bright or intelligent? I don't think so, I don't think it could be, and in fact I think you're probably a bit smarter than most people.

I happen to be of the opinion that a lion chasing down and killing a zebra is one of the more beautiful phenomena in nature.

Zachsans comment about the lion had nothing to do with the moral inclinations of lions but more to do with its actions. You see the lion will be just a lion, it will hunt like a lion, and it will eat like a lion. It's not about what the lion represents as in terms of Buddhist thought, that's not the point. It was what the lion represents in reality, stripped of all human ideas and thought save for the true experience and wonder of the actions of a lion killing a zebra. It's not the killing itself but the act that matters.

[zachsan]

Thanks, Fa. I also find it curious how, when it ought to be clear that many people here aren't Buddhist, he answers almost every question within the context of Buddhism. It's like an atheist talking to a Christian about why he believes in evolution, and the Christian only answering with things like, "well the Bible says..."

Do u think a Lion will help you if u break ur leg?

What?

Do you think the Mona Lisa will help you if you break your leg? How about Niagara Falls? A solar eclipse? Does this make those things less beautiful?

If we link beauty with compassion...

Well, you're obviously equating beauty with compassion.

[doc]

I think humans are pretty ignorant beings.

[liutangsanzang]

Fa Hui, i also dont understand u. U have the habit to correct me, like if u were some elder monk talking to a novice. U even insulted me, calling me an asshole. And after u wonder if there is a connection between me and Happeh, but in reality i ve never insulted u, and in reality u had a behaviour more close to Happeh. And doc didnt correct u tough he is against personal attacks.

Do u think u r wiser than me?

For instance u say i miss the mark.

How do u know i miss the mark, are u awaken?

U see the lion trough ur own perception and mental fabrication, samskara.

I see it trough mine.

For u the lion killing is not a question of ignorance or ethics, well that s ur point of view, i have a different, but why u want to correct me? R u superior?

Or would u say buddhism misses the mark when it talks about ignorance of animals and specially ignorance of the suffering of other living beings?

And what about the idea that man and lion are linked? That a man may become a lion with transmigration. Killing the animal as a man is not an ethical act? And if it is does it stop to be an ethical choice when he becomes a lion? The jain would say yes, the killing of the zebra by the lion is unethical and violent. The buddhists might say it is samsara. Can u prove the jains and the buddhists are wrong? U think jains miss the mark, while u and zachsan have found the truth, o great gurus!

U say u dont understand me and that is pretty wise but most of the time u act like u understand better than me. U teach me meditation, u preach that i dont understand zen, u affirm that i am ideological. Please check urself and if u dont understand me zen do not contradict urself and dont put categorical judgments. R u my master?

And why did u insult me?

Anyway, thanks for the comments and the work on my ego.

I m certainly closed to other people and ignorant and i do a lot of meditation to get linked to other beings through the understanding of their suffering. Hope it will get better with times, thanks for the concern. As far as Z is concerned i have a bit of understanding of why he thinks it is beauty, but since my studying of philosophy i find it difficult to define beauty and i m reluctant to believe senses for judging beauty.

Again would u say that a beautiful japanese fascist women is beautiful? Is beauty just a sensation or is sensation fooling us and in fact we should inquire into compassion to reach the true sense of beauty? A fried baby would taste good, caged chicken eggs taste good, yet according to Thich Nhat Hanh this eggs are full of anger.

So yes i m sorry but i question the ignorance of the lion and the fact of calling it beautiful. It is not a question of buddhism, it is a question of reality: has the lion some understanding of the suffering of the zebra and of other sentient beings.

And i put it as a question: i dont say the lion is ignorant of the suffering of other beings. Tough i think there are objective facts that would tend to prove the buddhist view on animals is quite true, like the fact that the lion will eat u rather than help u if u have a broken leg and he will not think of the children u will leave alone.

Yet i question.

I m sure u ve a lot of compassion and understanding on philosophy. U wanting to learn close to Thich Nhat Han is a sign of ur devotion to love and wisdom. I ve also spent a lot of time in Thay's monastery, so we are dhamma brothers. But i dont understand ur persistant attacks. Is it some shaolin trick or is it agressivity and ignorance brought as wisdom by ur ego? So would u question ur understanding on meditation and lions?

Om and peace and love

[zachsan]

Liu, when Fa Hui said you "missed the mark", I don't think he was insulting you or saying anything about your level of spiritual advancement.

I think he was referring to the fact that you completely ignored the point of my argument to get into some asinine discussion about the moral standing of lions.

So I'll restate my point: Beauty is subjective. Do you disagree? Please do not include the word "lion" in your response.

[liutangsanzang]

Ok, u say beauty is subjective.

My answer is i dont know.

If i was platonician or hegelian i would look for an objective essence of beauty, what all beautiful things have in common.

Some like Wittgenstein would say that such an approach is foolish, that there is no such thing as a definition but that there are only games of speech.

Personnaly i try not to choose between these two options.

Art was the topic of the year when i passed the exams to become philosophy teacher and i didnt end in being clear about what is beauty!

I do not reject the ideas of essence and objectivity, like there is an essence of a circle or an essence of a radio.

As for myself being buddhist, i m certainly influenced by buddhism but i do my best not to be dogmatical. I m certainly more dogmaical about marxism, socialism and anarchism!

For me buddhism is a good philosophy with a lot of inspiring insights and that is why i like to quote it. But it does not mean i approve everything of it.

To get back to the original question of bigger breasts and whether it is beautiful, i think buddhism and vegetarianism are interesting because they bring a different insight.

When i was in Tibet i bought this green Tara for whom i have a special devotion. I mean i bought a painting not Tara! Yet this green tara was a little fat, what would go against my taste. But the fact that she is a little fat is indeed inspiring because it negates the jain idea that killing animals, despite their expressed will to live, is violent. So i like my green tara for being a little fat, tough i dont know if in fact she is not too much fat.

I always find funny that Guanyin and the chinese buddhas are so fat, while sakyamuni fasted until his stomach would touch his spinal bones (that might have a tantric symbolism( And the tibetan taras are slimmer than the chinese guanyins.

So are big chinese breast grown from killing and modern farming are beautiful or not? I dont know, but contrary to most people i doubt it.

And Thich Nhat Hanh would say that these eggs are full of an anger energ.

So is anger beautiful? Can we talk about beauty about an energy or emotion? Most of the time we do so, and we say that anger and violence are ugly.

And note that my reasoning does not imply buddhism, it just implies philosophy.

So what do u think about these big breasts? Would it ever equal the breasts of this hindu vegetarian divinities?


Om and peace and love

[liutangsanzang]

And to get back to the question of the lion killing is beautiful or no, if u say that it is beautiful zen u seem to put an affirmation.

I prefer to put a question and i try to do so and i try to question my will of questionning and whether i am really questionning if killing is beautiful or not.

What most people seem not to do.

So is a lion killing beautiful or not?

Is a caged chicken beautiful or not?



Om and peace and love

[zachsan]

Congratulations on having gone to school for philosophy.

Myself, I think beauty has to be understood as subjective, if we're going to allow the word to retain any meaning. If you equate "beauty" with "good", like you're obviously doing, then you have no use for the word "beauty" in the first place. "My mother is a beautiful and kind woman" becomes "My mother is a good good woman". And this conversation never takes place.

So what do u think about these big breasts? Would it ever equal the breasts of this hindu vegetarian divinities?

More than just equal. Unless I'm mistaken you can't grab divine boobs. Plus all those arms are a little creepy. But hey, whatever you're into...

[zachsan]

And to get back to the question of the lion killing is beautiful or no, if u say that it is beautiful zen u put an affirmation.

I said I find it beautiful. I never said it was beautiful in any objective or essential sense. Not only are you attacking a straw man but the straw man sounds a lot like your own argument.

...And regarding what I said before about wasting breath, I have now wasted quite a bit of it. I mean, virtual breath... you get the point. I think I'm done.

[liutangsanzang]

Ok, but if u say that beauty is subjective, arent u taking a side?

Maybe silence is the way not to take sides?

And i dont necessarly equal beauty to good, for instance abstract painting can have its own beauty.

But some would say indeed that what is more important is not the painting but the painter, what would turn us back to the question of the goodness of the painter. This is also an eastern approach onn how to look like at a painting.

And would a beautiful abstract painting be beautiful if it was painted on the skin of a tortured and skinned innocent woman?

According to Plato, yes we have to equate beauty to goodness. They have in common that why we find something beautiful or good is that we are in love with them and we desire them. See the Symposium.

And personally i dont want to be in love with a beautiful fascist woman, the senses are not relevant for me in this case. Tough i want to love her, but i cannot agree on her hatred and violence. I would not call beauty her beauty. In this sens u r right, i tend to equal beauty with goodness when ethics can be linked to the beautiful object in question.

And i doubt that i should be in love with bigger breasts when it comes to chinese people. I tend to think that, ethically, chinese is one of the worst food in the world. Just an abnormal or even subnormal doubt.

Not talking about buddhism

Om and peace and love

[zachsan]

Fun!!

Ok, but if u say that beauty is subjective, arent u taking a side?

Yes.

Maybe silence is the way not to take sides?

I'm sure it is.

And i dont equal beauty to good, for instance abstract painting can have its own beauty.

Will Homage to the Square help you if your arm is broken?

And according to Plato, yes we have to equate beauty to goodness. They have in common that why we find something beautiful or good is that we are in love with them and we desire them. See the Symposium.

OK. I disagree.

And personally i dont want to be in love with a beautiful fascist woman, the senses are not relevant for me in this case.

I never said I wanted to be in love with the theoretical hot fascist chick. Yet, I do want to give her every inch of my love. I want a whole lotta love. Selah.

And i doubt that i should be in love with bigger breasts.

[mbokohutu]

Fa Hui, i also dont understand u. U have the habit to correct me, like if u were some elder monk talking to a novice. U even insulted me, calling me an asshole. And after u wonder if there is a connection between me and Happeh, but in reality i ve never insulted u, and in reality u had a behaviour more close to Happeh. And doc didnt correct u tough he is against personal attacks.

You just made a big mistake. I don't know you and have never talked to you, and you are talking about my behavior? You asked for it.

Do u think u r wiser than me?

Sure. You can't even speak english right.

And why did u insult me?

Because you are crazy? Because your posts make no sense? Because people are only being polite and tolerating you, and he ran out of tolerance?

I m certainly closed to other people and ignorant

It is always good to admit when you are ignorant. That way we don't have to tell you.

Again would u say that a beautiful japanese fascist women is beautiful?

What is it with you and Japanese? You one of those racist Chinese? Don't feel bad Japan kicked your ass in WWII. It's not like your country is 50 times bigger than Japan and your population is 1000 times more than Japan.

Losers. Just accept they kicked your pathetic ass and get over it. I bet they would do it again if there was another war.

Is beauty just a sensation or is sensation fooling us and in fact we should inquire into compassion to reach the true sense of beauty? A fried baby would taste good, caged chicken eggs taste good, yet according to Thich Nhat Hanh this eggs are full of anger.

Ya. You are being crazy on purpose. All those "elevated" guys talk crazy on purpose. That is how they keep people coming to them. People don't understand the craziness, so they keep going back to try and figure it out. Great way to make money.

So yes i m sorry but i question the ignorance of the lion and the fact of calling it beautiful. It is not a question of buddhism, it is a question of reality: has the lion some understanding of the suffering of the zebra and of other sentient beings.

No. It is a question of whoop de doo and loop de loo. You are just playing mind games to stir up their brains. Then when their brains are good and confused, you can move in and take over.

You guys that don't know kung fu better be careful. All those things I talk about that you don't believe are real, and they will bite you if you don't watch what is going on.

This guy will turn you into a cult zombie if your brain is weak.

I ve also spent a lot of time in Thay's monastery, so we are dhamma brothers. But i dont understand ur persistant attacks.

They can't help it. They are still at the animal level of humanity. They have not raised themselves up to be human beings yet. The only thing they know is barking like a dog.

By the way. Who is Thay? Your next door neighbors kid? You spend a lot of time in the dirt monastery he built in his sandbox?