??? Martial arts

[Maestro]

i always think its funny when people seperate taiji and "kung fu" heheheheh

..internal, external, the more i hear people blabber about the differences the more i wonder how much they know what they are talking about in relation to the subject..

anyhow, interesting responses..thought docs comment about wing chun was particularly interesting since ive heard him say different about that particular art before..wonder what opened your mind..i could only imagine...

amitabha

[pazman]

I trained taekwondo and a little bit of hapkido for eleven years. Then, at college I did tonglangquan and chen style taijiquan. Since coming to Japan, I've been doing Shodokan Aikido, Kendo, and whatever else I can find the time for (Judo, BAJI!, boxing, etc). I also went to China for two weeks last summer to train at Shi Decheng's school. All have been amazing experiences.

[daodejing]

It's funny how many people choose to delude themselves into thinking that Taijiquan is something beyond a style of gongfu. Anyways, internal to external, external to internal, the training is different but the training principle is the same. I try not to be all soft, or all hard, some of my "hard martial arts" techniques are getting steadily softer, and some of my taiji is both soft and hard. I try not to get caught up in dichotomies, it's better to just relax and act as your body thinks it should act.

[meattosser]

Very true. Just like my slogan at the bottom says, a well-rounded gongfu system must have internal AND external training. It's good to train the body's muscular reflexes, speed, and endurance, but you should also dedicate time to chikung (qigong) training if you want to generate the true power of chinese (and some japanese) martial techniques. Throws/Wrestling, joint locks/grappling, trapping, hand/elbow strikes, kicks, hard AND soft chi kung, all of these things are valuable.

[zachsan]

hehe, Real Gongfu: Certified By Meattosser!

i think it was only in the 30's that the current method of classifying gongfu came about. the taoist roots of gongfu are strong enough that a big part of gongfu was supposed to be harmonizing opposites and all that jazz. i doubt that traditionally a school would like being called either specifically hard or specifically soft. and besides, as you train in gongfu, then naturally your ideas about what exactly 'soft' and 'hard' is will slowly change.

i think the distinction could be useful for beginners trying to figure out what the hell it is they're getting themselves into, but once it gets to a certain point your gongfu is just your gongfu and that's how it is.

[meattosser]

zachsan said: "Real Gongfu: Certified by MeatTosser!"

Ha ha, I don't know if you're agreeing with me or being sarcastic, lol. In any case, it's not something certified by me, I'm just a ghetto mexican who loves traditional chinese boxing (aka kungfu, wushu, wuyi, chuan-fa, etc.).
These are things that have been continuously stated by many masters, ancient and modern. I totally agree with what you said right now though; in the end, all major gongfu systems are both soft and hard. That's part of what makes them so profound.

Anyway, peace y'all, stay strong...

[shaolinstylee]

I always love hearing how people try to explain hard and soft styles... There isn't one without the other, and always a little of each in each other.

[Fa Hui]

Sometimes I go to this Taiji forum, and lately there has been this kid saying that Shaolin is 100% hard and 0% soft, and Chen Taiji 50/50 and Yang style is 100% soft and 0% hard.

To me, this is plain ignorance. Having done the three of those styles, I know that there is both hard and soft in everything. In Taiji there is a different way of approach that may make it look like it is softer. For instance, in the advanced stages one no longer has to rely on massive muscular use, but on intent, energy, and bodily structure; which ends up using a lot of the more subtle muscles and tendons. The bones also seem to become very hard, which is where the saying "Steel wrapped in cotton" may come from.

Peace.

[Maestro]

internal-external are relative to each other in that, they are both describeing one thing, the individual

there cannot be hard and no soft or soft and no hard, it all comes down to your level of discipline and awareness that you understand the correct times to be soft or hard

in the end though there is no classifications, because they are inseperable

amitabha

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