Touchdown Shi De Cheng Wushu Guan!

[Maestro]

even though you really seem to wanna go to wudang to train i dont think its what you really want. wu dang does seem really pretty and id love to go there, not saying u shouldnt go but, if you want to learn good internal i would go to beijing or chen village, theres other places to go but those 2 have good peeps.

i read an article a year or so about a place in chen village run by one of the chen diamonds i think..either way the place was stirctly about chen taiji/qi gong and focus on combat training..ill look for it

[Josh x]

OK, I want to help you understand where I'm coming from and my particular situation, Doc you're halfway there but not quite encompassing everything with what you've just pointed out.

Firstly here's an extract from an email I sent mum, it was mother's day (Australia) and she had called me when I had just arrived at Da Fa Wen Si about 7.30am:

I had quite the experience today. When you called me I told you I was at a temple; in many ways it was a smaller version of the Shaolin temple minus the influx of tourists and venders. When I approached one of the larger halls of the temple I found myself in a conversation with a man who was praying just outside (later found out he was a monk). On my way in I noticed there were kung fu students dressed in the iconic shaolin attire; orange robes, shaved heads, white leggings. Before long the chat I had with this guy led to questions about the details of the school that was obviously operating there. He took me to the head coach of the school. We talked for about ten minutes before it became clear my limited Chinese and his even moreso limited English really couldn't answer the questions I had. Luckily a Chinese guy who'd been raised in France, whose English was excellent and who was living in the temple as a student, translated.

You may be surprised but you actually know this temple (I thought it was familiar the more I looked around), it is the place where Shi De Yang's student (serious monk) from the Discovery Channel show 'fight quest' lived. Don't worry, this isn't that monk's school, I imagine it was chosen as a location because it is very scenic and located in the heart of the Song mountains unlike the often 'uglier', concrete buildings that function as schools in and around Dengfeng.

Anyway, after about an hour of talking with this guy he told me (translated from the coach) that he was surprised that I had found the school, the only students who were accepted or that knew about the place were introduced by insiders. He continued by telling me that tourists would often petition to study and were turned down regularly.
The school is different in its approach, they train nine hours a day, it's isolated, no internet anyway nearby (except back in Dengfeng, 10 mins away by car), Chinese lesson everyday at 6.30. Most importantly is the atmosphere. The temple is right in the mountains, I think it's only a few k's away from the Shaolin temple itself though it is unbelievably peaceful and the tourists that I did see were there to pray/pay respects, not the mobs of tour groups yelling and taking photos I saw in the former.
We talked some more and I expressed a wish to study there, though aware that I was just the tourist he spoke about, despite this I inquired about the possibility. What he translated then on went something like this:

"They don't often accept tourists, I've seen them turn away people from all over China, Guangzhou, (some other notable cities I can't remember). He says he can see you're serious about training here, even though you haven't been introduced. (As Buddhists) they believe in fate and he thinks that you coming was meant to be; so if wish to train here then they will accept you as a student."

I'm not sure what I will do. I have the details of the school which, as I said, is an active temple with practicing monks and scenery I've only seen in the most remote areas I've hiked around. Primarily though, it seems to be offering the training that I am looking for.
(END)

Now I'll be honest, when he said it was 'meant to be' I was sold... almost. I'll come back to this later in the post.

Doc, what you've described as the HUMP (and its symptoms) rings true for me in some ways, others not so. I've begun to feel complacent about the training because of the lax attitude at the school; but despite feeling tired and slowly fostering a growing hostility for Dengfeng, I'm still ready to do put my all into the training. For me, I've had a great experience at DeCheng's but now it's not offering me what I want.
While I've done my share of training at the school, to some degree, it's been more of a holiday than a serious training experience. I don't blame anyone, not that there's anything to be blamed for, I just feel its time to move on.

The hardest thing about this decision isn't interrupting my training but leaving behind some great friendships I've developed with the kids and people here. Though ultimately, I came here to train so in the near future I will go elsewhere.

As I said before, I've now resolved to train in kung fu (or qigong/taiji) while I'm here, save the kickboxing for Thailand. Thanks anyway for the advice, it's always been appreciated.

I am very tempted to go to Da Fa Wen Si to study. The conversation I had was convincing (though I bear in mind that it was and is just that) and the location stunning. In many ways it is what I imagine the Shaolin temple may have looked like ten/fifteen years ago. I believe you would know something about the training here Doc, considering your part in the fight quest episode and it having been used as both a living and training area. As a side note of trivia, the head coach I spoke to was the Sanda sparring partner (not the last fight rival) with DeYang's American student, you can see them boxing the suspended punching bags.

I am prepared to give this school a week, then go from there. They seem to be teaching a similar cirriculum to DeCheng's from what I could gather which would be excellent as I could continue with Shaolin sytems rather than begin again in Wudang Shan.

I am aware that from my posts this may come across as me constantly flip-flopping; you wouldn't be wrong either. There are many options open to me, it's just an issue of making the best choice with the information available.

As for the girlfriends, I'll keep you posted, got my supply of 'biyuntao' just for the occasion!

[Maestro]

lolo, my name is easy to remember, just call me master, its easy.

[doc]

He's "Decheng's brother" because I can't remember his name.

Just like you're going to be "maestro" for ****ing forever, because I won't remember your name either.

Josh, two things.

One, you can visit Tagou, set up some private sanda lessons just to get some of that experience. It's not good at Decheng's school, you might find better at Tagou. Do an hour a day, get it into your system.

Two, you're reaching what I call the HUMP. It's when you start to wonder what the **** you're doing there. You're tired, miserable, none of it makes sense, you hate the place. It's normal. Hang in there for a bit, and it will get better. You'll start to really develop a feel for the forms, start to understand them, start to ingrain them. That's when you've really accomplished something. If you can hold on another month, and get a deeper understanding of this stuff, I think you'll be happier in the long run.

Three, getting a girlfriend there always makes it more fun. If I could have done it, no doubt you will do it.

OK, that was three. Escaping to Wudangshan might present you with the same bullshit nonsense that you're experiencing now. But, you should go anyway, and let us know how it is. My trip there was cancelled years ago, after Shaolin, because of a bad case of dysentery.

[Josh x]

I've been effectively dissuaded from Sanda by your previous posts Doc. I think that now I've made the journey to China I should focus my energy studying the traditional arts, I am also very taken with the idea of living in the mountains rather than metropolis. I will save the kickboxing for Thailand.

I have had a very interesting day, it has made me question my future plans. I will write this up soon when my time isn't so inflexible.

Always an adventure in Shaolin.

[Maestro]

doc u got a link or anything for more infor about dechengs brothers school. and even though it sounds funny why do you always call him "de chengs brother" whats his name?

[doc]

Yunnan is below Tibet; it is a beautiful fantastic place, that is more easily accessible than Tibet, and for many reasons, more spectacular.

Thailand is a horrible place to be in September October, see one of my recent posts in the Russboasia thread.

One other option is to go train at Decheng's brother's school in Beijing. He runs a great sanda school there. As China's national sanda champion for many years, he knows what he's doing. Nice guy too. Trained a bit with him many years ago.

[Josh x]

I'll do my best to address your responses.

I have decided to go WudangShan for many reasons: the scenery, the atmosphere, the difference of martial perspective but essentially for the internal arts of qigong and taiji. I'm not particularly interested in learning the gong fu on offer there. Part of the reason I wanted to come to China was to learn how to fight, expecting to find this here was a fallacy on my part. I believe that the method of training the students (at least from what I've seen at DeCheng's school) in gong fu is a slow, arduous process that takes many years to foster serious martial skill. However, when it all 'clicks' for the student and they understand the various uses for the techniques they have practiced, they are worth avoiding.
Case in point. Every Saturday we spar in Sanda for an hour, watching pairs fight and then participating. Now I have limited sparring experience, I can throw a punch and know my kicks but they aren't anything special (yet). The students don't train in Sanda but some of these kids have been learning kung for years. Apart from one student, I took down the other two older ones without much difficulty.
That is both the beauty and labour of kung fu in my opinion; it is both vast in its variety and thus considerable effort must be made to make it efficient and therefore practical. Contrasted against arts like boxing and styles like, for example, krav maga, that are purely functional. However, this hasn't deterred me from my studies and the experience has strengthened my resolve to pursue this art as far as I can.
In saying this, I will be making the journey to Thailand later in the year after I'm fully China'd out. Without hesitation I can tell you when I get there it won't take long before I'll be in a muay thai gym. Here I think I can get the education in sparring/self-defence that I initially sought.

I think to really appreciate this experience (from a martial standpoint) you a) must have some idea of what you are looking for and b) have some understanding of why you're coming. Now that I've had a taste, I am more clued in about what Shaolin is about. I feel that I will come back, one day; perhaps when I need some perspective in my life.

I think you raise an important point about expectations Doc. Yes, if you want Shaolin to cater to your own illusions and media fuelled impressions of the place you're bound to be unsatisfied. But there must be a balance somewhere; if you're not prepared to make an effort for what you want, resisting expectation, disappointment is just as certain. Understanding the culture and way things are done martially has been helpful in finding this happy medium. It has neither made me cynic or a dreamer; just more realistic about this balance.

Maestro, I will be in Thailand if my plans don't change between then and now. I forsee myself being there anywhere from August/September onwards, though I may go back to Singapore and work for a couple of months to top up my money box. Rest assured though, Thailand is a safe bet; I'll be there.

Doc, I have climbed TaishiShan (thought I wrote about that?) and tomorrow I'll be trekking up the temple path to Da Fa Wen Si; the Shaolin grounds will have to wait for another week or two. Don't know about Yunnan, if I can spend some time there on my way to Tibet I will consider it. And yes, see you in Thailand (no jokes!)

Oh and by the way, I noticed there was a sense of finality in those last posts Doc. Don't expect I'm giving up on the journal just because I've left Shaolin. This memoir is just as important a reference for me as I hope it is for all you Russboians out there.

Josh

[LFJ]

ironically, i'm considering going to thailand myself.. but for academic purposes, not as an apostate from shaolin!

[doc]

I'm not sure he's going to Thailand. It was a joke.

It just seems to be the place people end up going after living in the shits of Dengfeng.

[Maestro]

hey i didnt know your going to thailand...when u planning to go down there?

and take docs advice, i really wanna go to the places in the old(or new i havent been in there) photo gallery we got here at russbo

[doc]

You've had the typical Shaolin experience. Now you know why I tell people a year is too much...

It's all about expectations. Keep them low and you'll survive China. Don't expect Wudangshan to be any different, or any other area in China. You're dealing with a group of people who, for the most part, are interested in survival, making money, and getting out. Not finding a teacher there who really cares about your training is to be expected.

But, over time, I think you'll look back on this experience as a hugely positive one, to the point where one day, you will make the journey back. I did. Twenty times. Granted, that might not say much for my sanity, but, it was an experience nonetheless.

Make sure you get to Emeishan, Huangshan, Guilin and Yunnan province while you are there. Did you climb Tiashishan yet? Get to the mountainous national park and rope bridge above Shaolin? Make sure you experience that before you leave.

See you in Thailand.

[Maestro]

interesting, myself i would go to chen village, its closer and the gung fu is better then what you will get in wudang. but it sounds like you just wanna hang out at wudang or both i dunno. i know all the gung fu ive seen outta wudang isnt very impressive.

either way, i really like your posts and whatnot, its very interesting, i gotta cut this short cause i just got off work and i gotta eat and go to bed so i can enjoy the day.

so enjoy your time at shaolin while u can

[Josh x]

It's been a month and a half that I've spent here in Dengfeng. I was thinking to myself of late about the person I was who walked through the Shi De Cheng Wushu Guan door six weeks ago; I am now beginning to see the changes from the time I've invested here.
I was pretty clueless when I came to China, did my reading, had a small selection of phrases to use, researched and planned but, for the most part, had my hand held from point A to B. It occured to me in the taxi to the internet cafe just how casually I deal with life and the necessities that were such an effort only weeks before.
While my kung fu has developed in leaps and bounds that would not have been possible in Australia, I've taken more from this journey as a lesson in life than simply a discipline of martial arts. The kung fu experience has become the cultural experience.
However, with this revelation I have decided to leave Shaolin. I believe that it is time to explore China and focus my attention on different disciplines.
The training I have recieved here has been excellent but I would like to give you some perspective of the school and of living and training here. Hopefully, it will be helpful to you and you're own adventures to Dengfeng and the surrounding countryside.

I have already had an experience that will stay with me and influence me for years to come, I do not regret in any way coming (and staying) here. I do believe however, that the experience I have had may not be the ideal situation for serious martial artists. For me the question became where do I draw the line between expecting too much of the fantasy and becoming too lenient about my standards of training. I think the training I have recieved has been heavily influenced by several factors: my age (19); my level of kung fu (1 year of prior training); and the absence of Shi De Cheng.
I will elaborate.

My age. Because there is only a year's difference between myself and the head student-coach I am often put together with him to learn. I have no doubt in his abilities but there is an apparent lack of attention. To some degree this is the dilemma I experienced about self-motivation/role as a student/etc (see earlier posts).

My level of kung fu. This plays into the aforementioned; because of my limited experience there is tendency to assign me to the younger coach. This is not to say I am taught nothing, or that help is not there if I seek it. Simply that there is little concern about poor technique on my part and its correction.

Shi De Cheng. From what I have seen, there is a different atmosphere when Shi De Cheng is at training; more serious and more meticulous about technique. Can't comment much about this though.

Let me be clear about this, I do not views these as negatives BUT I have seen an experienced German martial arts instructor stay for one night; he was neither impressed by the teaching of the younger coaches nor the location (school is located in a street, it's not the mountainside Dorothy) and left the next day.

I will be here until the end of May/beginning of June and then I will explore the mountainside of Wudang Shan. I will join a school there to learn taiji and qigong. While I could do both of these here in Shaolin, I've heard that Wudang Shan is breathtaking and I'm looking forward to experiencing the Daoist culture and customs. Looking forward to your responses.

[doc]

Wait until you see the kids with broken arms walking around with cloth and sticks tied to their limb...