Topic Twelve: The trademark of the Shaolin name

[blooming tianshi lotus]

BTL, please forgive me...I honestly can't understand your posts. Could you or somebody else please maybe condense your exact argument down into a few statements?

On a real note though, I don't really think so. It's a complicated case and I'm glad that it's in good hands.

This is only my opinion but I think there is a great case to be made of intectual property and diffrent precedences. I also am aware that in Chinas, last 50 yrs of political history, shaolin has been under some adaptions. These have had a host of repercussion.

What about the 5th amendment and the right to dissolve relations?? I can't say I've seen it ( getting around to it though ) , but that's what it relates to right? .........?????

[blooming tianshi lotus]

I'm sure !

I

am


sure ( shoor or shuwer)

BL

[pazman]

BTL, please forgive me...I honestly can't understand your posts. Could you or somebody else please maybe condense your exact argument down into a few statements?

[blooming tianshi lotus]

I'm sure !

[doc]

I'm glad you're not an attorney.

[blooming tianshi lotus]

Is that so Stylee??? Apparently you're not real schooled in neither business nor law.


Product is where the whoe significance of the right to name lays ( in this case ) .

And fyi, you might not want to yourself ( naivety and lack of info noted ) , but I have a funny feeling ShiYongXin and his education may feel differently..........If there's one thing in life he's doing.......it's winning this case.

It's a shaolin thing.don't let it trouble you....he has our backs

Doc: what's been taught at shaolin has changed over the last whole 50 + yrs and you know exactly why that is! I believe I feel where you're at interperatively with what's happening over there and the best plan of attack ( and don't pretend you don't have loyalty there and to that goal ..unless you need the contingency lol......) ........ but that IP right thing is the whole point........... what the heck gonfu ever exists with out it????? Those things they're selling in non-ever -affiliated -to old school shaolin schools and dojos never were and never will be shaolin gongfu. That only comes with the knowledge we all know the pre - mod necc shaolin contingent have ( as in before the new school guanxi inspired necc monks ( and related issue have) and btw : why so many are for te first time getting de-robed) To be frank though Rich, I'm even half embarressed for the rest of them .


( ......"but I am shaolin .......no I've never met a monk or even understand what they're saying
about how it works it most of the time ............... and yah ppl come to me and I tell them I can sell them "shaolin gongfu" and I take their money when they wanted the real service I pretend to be ......and the real shaolin don't really talk to me about it after that , but I do.....I do practice shaolin gongfu !!!!!) "

Give me a break okay !!! It's froof and farsical . It takes away business from shaolin and it's not okay to embellish their delusion nor support the upblics confusion on what they're actually buying. Shaolin is sacred and and wuseng right is earnt through a comnbination of things the gongfu ( which wouldn't even exist without the rest) . They might have a self defence system , but shaolin gongfu it's not! It's like buying a sarsparilla and being told it's coke. It's not coke and until you tasted the real thing, you'd never even know . Funny egos they have!!!!


We all know the prc conception and GR story and how it effected shaolins liberation and freedom to do their thing and what they had to repress temporarily just to keep it alive and out of the closet at all. Do you understand the prc wre killing these ppl if they contionued itr's per[etuation in that capacity ???? What a humble sacrifice and commitment imho!!! Yes, it could have even been your xingwei's yangmings and xinghaos and de qians and dechengs and xinglongs etc at any other time had they been there then. This is a very real memory in the history of this. Ppl saw shifu , friends and good men die and some have been walking on extremely brittle ice for many many years to keep it alive and above board. No mucking about. Good men died and you do what you must to bide your time. Don't get carried away with complacencey and USisms. Shaolin is in action to preserve itself! Just because he's not offering it was before their right now, it doesn't mean shaolin doesn't own it ( and exclusively understand it in it's entirity btw ). Internal IP is the real distinguishing factor and considering most "gongfu" practioners can't even deal with the fact of qi at all, higher levels of skill related to the same is ludicrous to believe they have a right to pretend they sell. I don't know what tjhey think thery're selling, but we all know it's mcdojo. Shaolin it's not! Why the crimmeny do you think a discpleship - or robe is so hard to earn.???? They're kidding themselves and stealing our market. According to the courts, the the crux!

I myself have , through a great turn of karma, found 2 greatly awesome WC sigung from different pre-GR systems ( who also btw acknowledge shaolin rooting ) . Old school is old school and the abbott in his wisdom and foresigt has done what he thought necc to ensure shaolins prosterity..even if it is only maintainence to revive later.

Yah the "monks" and true shaolin wuseng ( and even others) have right to do and sell their thing, but shaolin it belongs to and the truly loyal wuseng to wuseng goals and aim , will sacrifice their they're egos on it , or they were never fully their anyway. The big picture is where wuseng is t and for the ones that don'tr support it, IMO they're just not apart of it. ( though fml and gwailo and funnily un-indocrinated ) We just want to see it live another age. If it's not your goal or if you're one of the others .you'll A. be selling as Wc or Xingi or clf or whatever and the name should be of no concern. It was a loaner.

Un-winnable ha??? Well , considering this only a part time conversation for us and the mans whose argument counts in court devotes his entire present life to it, I think I'd prefer to reserve an opinion on that outcome.

cheers folks

BL

[shaolinstylee]

The gong fu is significant, but it's the name that's important.

The gong fu is the product, whether good or not, and may have some underlying issue, but you wouldn't even want to bring it up in one of these cases...

[doc]

She's right, but, it's not the issue, even though it is.

Yongxin can't even think about suing over the teaching of Shaolin gong fu; there's too much of it, and it's already been spread throughout the world to some degree, in some fashion. Besids, what's taught in Shaolin has changed significantly over the past ten years already. An intellectual property rights battle with this stuff would be absurd and unwinnable.

But, as I've mentioned before, getting rid of the other schools and turning Shaolin into a foreigner's training paradise, is a mighty righteous economical thing to do. And they're doing it. Yongxin has attempted to open his own versions of Shaolin Temple schools worldwide; in some cases, as with Yanzi in London, he's been successful, in others, a dismal failure. I would think that he has learned something from that.

The gong fu is significant, but it's the name that's important.

[shaolinstylee]

intellectual property is all it comes down to......Imho anyway.

no, it's all in a name....

thats what is protected. If that were the case, you'd have seen a lot more lawsuits in the martial arts over crap like this, especially in lineage battles.

[blooming tianshi lotus]

We're talking about the business of selling gongfu! At the end of the day, intellectual property is all it comes down to......Imho anyway.

BL

[doc]

LYF, that's why Yongxin is suing. He's got a bunch of people out there who, through their ignorance, appear to be "representing" his organization. I'd be pissed too.

As for the product end of it, if you think that Yongxin is suing over "intellectual property rights", that is, Shaolin gong fu, that would be a really tough one to sue over. I think he'd be wasting his time on that one. The name issue no doubt would be an easy case for him, in my opinion.

Good point on the intellectual property issue though.

[blooming tianshi lotus]

Well that's the crux for most of them isn't it. Nicely put .


BL

[LeiYunFat]

Yongxin would probably deem that comment unsuitable for his visions of the new Shaolin Temple, seeing as how he has ignored it.

As for the people that call themselves Shaolin; it's for the attachments that come with it. If you are any sort of Shaolin Temple, people will come to you like you were the original. It was pretty bulletproof, too-- till now. People probably didn't expect the real original (along with a bunch of monks) to come knocking at their temple doors demanding reparations.

[blooming tianshi lotus]

It has nothing to do with products, or what is taught.

.

Actually in the "Christian sience" case, and the courts closing comments, they did say

"Generic names are regarded by the law as free for all to use. They are in the public domain. ***To grant an exclusive right to one firm of use of the generic name of a product would have to be equivilent to creating a monopoly in that particular product, something that the trademark laws were never intended to accomplish."

I'm still begging to differ there but nicely nueturalized anyway.

The product of shaolin though, as we are all aware , is centred on reliant on principals of buddhism as it's distinguishing aspect. This is what makes it so seperate to Mcjos. It's a complicated argument and not really mine to have .

cheers nonetheless

[plumflower_pm]

I searched for info about that suit as I remember it too... couldn't find anything but here's a list of things McDonalds is currently or has recently been sued for. Yeah, it's OT, and no, you probably don't need to know this, but here it is anyway.

not hiring an extremely obese guy
failing to tell people about trans-fat content in food
french fries not vegetarian
tough bagel
hot coffee
guy gets fat
woman receives a McBeating from two employees in the McParking lot
alleged rat head found in happy meal
actor who plays Ronald McDonald sues for unfair labor practices, refuses to return costume
Venezuela sues for failure to pay taxes